Woz. Why???

vintagegamer

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I have to vent on this topic- feel free to shoot me down if you want, yell at me, whatever, but I'm just not getting this whole movement at all. In an age where the pinball market for new pins is almost obsolete (with the exception of new titles like TRON and Transformers helping to keep it all alive), why would anyone ever ever ever pick the Wizard of Oz as a pin title???!!!!

I seriously doubt any guys are going to play it without feeling like they are looking gay, I can't imagine there being a ton of pin fans out there who are also Wizard of Oz fans, the movie is a classic yes but so is Apocalypse Now and I don't see an Apocalypse Now pin on the horizon, I'm just totally NOT GETTING THE WHY...

Please someone help me understand. Is it really going to be that huge of a success?? I might play it if someone sets the sound so you can listen to Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon while the game's playing (Floyd fans will know what I'm talking about). Otherwise, I don't think you'll ever see me standing in front of this game dumping quarters in it and waiting with anticipation to hear the Lollipop Guild song.. :(

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-76123313707631450#
 
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he's making his first pin.....i'd imagine he wanted to appeal to as wide of an audience as possible. WOZ is a timeless theme. and it's non-offensive. you can put it pretty much anywhere and not have to worry about somebody seeing something that will turn them off.

as for the looking gay thing......meh.....i'm 35, married, and have three kids. i don't really care how "gay" i look anymore. who have i got to impress? LOL. :)





(just for the record, i'm not buying one.....but i do hope that JJP succeeds. competition is a good thing)
 
I agree 100%. I guess I'm confused why people are so damn excited about something that could suck big time. I've seen the white wood mock up, and I don't get the appeal of 1000 stand up targets all over the place. You literally have to spell like 6 different things on the playfield. Wow that sounds stupid. And yes, the theme just does NOT make sense to me. Not one damn bit. I haven't watched the movie in 25 years, and am not sure that I would care to ever again.

But, it IS a very popular theme.... however it doesn't seem to want to even try to appeal to anyone below the age of 30.

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(just for the record, i'm not buying one.....but i do hope that JJP succeeds. competition is a good thing)

I agree with that for sure.
 
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I agree 100%. I guess I'm confused why people are so damn excited about something that could suck big time. I've seen the white wood mock up, and I don't get the appeal of 1000 stand up targets all over the place. You literally have to spell like 6 different things on the playfield. Wow that sounds stupid. And yes, the theme just does NOT make sense to me. Not one damn bit. I haven't watched the movie in 25 years, and am not sure that I would care to ever again.

But, it IS a very popular theme.... however it doesn't seem to want to even try to appeal to anyone below the age of 30.


as to the first point in bold: any idea if images of the white wood are floating around anywhere? i'd love to see it.


as to the second bold: my two oldest kids are 6 and 4....they both LOVE the wizard of oz movie and have seen it 3 or 4 times each.

again...it's a timeless theme. the age thing doesn't apply to this pin/theme IMO.
 
The audio will be really cool. Just the sample posted a while ago (shooter lane tune) was a great melange of a few Oz tunes.

The theme is classic. And it has more "baddies" than kiddie stuff: the pf has the enchanted forest, witch's castle, flying monkey, winkie guard, throne scoop, etc. It's not all munchkins and lollipops. (Although the similar Willy Wonka would make a cool pin theme, I think.)

WOZ/JJP is going after a broad international market. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that it will have an option for ticket dispensing as a redemption machine (which is THE major market for amusement devices these days). With redemption and a big lcd screen, it becomes attractive for the amusement park arcades everywhere, and is WAY more interesting than the typical ticket game. (And might get younger people playing pinball again!) It's an interesting strategy.

As for the sexual implications you mention, I'm secure in my masculinity and look forward to having a cool WOZ pin in my gameroom. Look at other pin themes, objectively, and you'll find many that aren't "manly" ones like hard rock bands or violent movies. Shrek? Roller Coaster Tycoon? Arabian Nights? No Good Gofers? Flintstones? etc. etc.

As for the whitewood, the latest JJP update had the team standing around one. The crystal ball looked pretty big!

Standups everywhere? This is a Keefer-programmed game. There WILL be a ton of modes and depth for the pin fanatic, with probably some killer almost-impossible-to-reach wizard mode(s). As well as fun for kids/novices with the pf toys. I don't understand criticism of the standups, esp. in the left outlane which is like a mini-game/goal in itself.

I'm pretty sure the pf toys will also be impressive, and the whole package promises to be a "next-gen" pin.
 
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The audio will be really cool. Just the sample posted a while ago (shooter lane tune) was a great melange of a few Oz tunes.

The theme is classic. And it has more "baddies" than kiddie stuff: the pf has the enchanted forest, witch's castle, flying monkey, winkie guard, throne scoop, etc. It's not all munchkins and lollipops. (Although the similar Willy Wonka would make a cool pin theme, I think.)

WOZ/JJP is going after a broad international market. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that it will have an option for ticket dispensing as a redemption machine (which is THE major market for amusement devices these days). With redemption and a big lcd screen, it becomes attractive for the amusement park arcades everywhere, and is WAY more interesting than the typical ticket game. (And might get younger people playing pinball again!) It's an interesting strategy.

As for the sexual implications you mention, I'm secure in my masculinity and look forward to having a cool WOZ pin in my gameroom. Look at other pin themes, objectively, and you'll find many that aren't "manly" ones like hard rock bands or violent movies. Shrek? Roller Coaster Tycoon? Arabian Nights? No Good Gofers? Flintstones? etc. etc.

Your points are well-taken, again I'm just trying to understand all that is going into this game. And yes you are correct, there are definitely games that are out there that aren't mega-masculine and get played often. But for this game I saw mention of "Ruby Slipper Flippers" and that, coupled with some of the other fruity stuff of the WOZ film in general, just made my masculometer go off....

If in fact the market is being targeted towards young children, then yes that could be definitely be an angle I did not look at. A friend said something interesting to me recently though: I told him I'd gotten a Time Warp pin, and that he'd probably like to check it out- he's in his mid 30s and is an avid video game fan, so I figured he'd like pins too.. His reply was "yeah, pinball was once cool; and then they invented television." He's in his mid 30s and all I can say is if someone his age, with his interests, feels that way about pinball in general, I'm sure there are many others out there who are the same way. And I have no doubt a WOZ pin is not going to make his comment look very inaccurate!
 
Come out of the closet now...cause if playing WoZ would make you feel gay, you are a homophobe, and we all know what 90% of homophobes are. ;)

I love the idea of competition as much as the next guy, but what operator is going to buy this pin, when for only a little more they can buy TWO Stern pins? This pin is overpriced, and a little too geared towards the collector market...I think in the rest of the market, it will either barely break even for them or be a flop.

P.S. I love the theme...who in their right mind doesn't like The Wizard of Oz? The witch, those crazy ass little monkeys...it can be done right, we'll just have to see if it is.
 
Come out of the closet now...cause if playing WoZ would make you feel gay, you are a homophobe, and we all know what 90% of homophobes are. ;)

I love the idea of competition as much as the next guy, but what operator is going to buy this pin, when for only a little more they can buy TWO Stern pins? This pin is overpriced, and a little too geared towards the collector market...I think in the rest of the market, it will either barely break even for them or be a flop.

P.S. I love the theme...who in their right mind doesn't like The Wizard of Oz? The witch, those crazy ass little monkeys...it can be done right, we'll just have to see if it is.

Yes, I like the movie too. We watch it at Easter. That doesn't make me say "I CAN'T WAIT FOR THIS PIN TO COME OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" though LOL.

Again, for the WOZ fans out there, I'm not looking to make anyone feel bad. I just can't see how this thing will get any play at a bar or sub shop or anyplace like that. I could be way off though.
 
I understand you not being excited about the theme. It doesn't appeal to me a whole lot either, but it also isn't unappealing. But my kids are excited about it, and I think my family will enjoy it. I think the theme is a smart decision from a business standpoint. Jack has worked with the license holders as CEO of Elaut USA, he has seen how successful their WOZ coin pusher is, and he knows what will sell. And from what I've read, WOZ is also a very successful slot machine. So the title does seem to appeal to a wide audience.

I started out with the $250 deposit figuring that it was refundable and I may as well see where this thing is going. I thought I'd probably drop out at some point, but I may as well get on the list. But once all the information started coming out, I decided that I'm comfortable with staying in. It is a risk, but it is also something new and exciting. I look at it like buying a new car, you don't get it as an investment. You use it , enjoy it, and expect to sell it or trade it later and not make a profit. It is a new company, an adventure, I'm having fun, and I think it is shaping up to be a pretty cool pin.
 
With how old WOZ maybe the don't have license the rights?

Also machine has the possibility of looking great with lots of gold,emerald and flying monkeys!
 
Wizard of OZ slot machines are some of the most popular in Las Vegas and Atlantic City. Try to get on a WOZ slot machine on a Saturday night without waiting inline. So I have no problem with the theme or its appeal to the masses.
 
This is why I hate abbriviations for pinball. Wouldn't Wizard of Oz Be: WOO?
 
This is why I hate abbriviations for pinball. Wouldn't Wizard of Oz Be: WOO?

WOZ works... W(izard) (of) OZ

Some people actually use abbreviations when they talk...they actually pronounce "TOTAN" instead of saying "Arabian Nights." So, saying "WOZ" sounds better than "WOO"
 
This is why I hate abbriviations for pinball. Wouldn't Wizard of Oz Be: WOO?

'WOO' would be an acronym. 'WOZ' is an abbreviation. There is a difference. Like J-Lo vs. JL. Which is easier to pronounce and sounds catchier? And WOZ is more reminiscent of 'OZ' than WOO is, so why the complaining?
 
'WOO' would be an acronym. 'WOZ' is an abbreviation. There is a difference. Like J-Lo vs. JL. Which is easier to pronounce and sounds catchier? And WOZ is more reminiscent of 'OZ' than WOO is, so why the complaining?

While we're complaining... I hate it when people say "WW2" instead of "World War 2". There are more syllables used when you say "WW2" instead of "World War 2"... I don't see how that helps anyone in conversations. In type it's easier; but when said, it's just a mess.

Anywho, not a huge fan of Wizard of Oz as a theme... but it's something new and I'm all for that. Plus it's being made by a different company, so it's not going be a reused play field or a series of reused ideas copied and pasted on a different field with 50 toys strapped randomly around the field.
 
I was skeptical of the theme at first, but based on Jerry V's art, Chris Granner's music, and everything Jack has said - I think the vibe of the game will be more along the lines of Lord of the Rings than Happy Rainbow Funtime.

As far as toys and features go - the theme has also inspired some very cool stuff.

-Melting witch toy
-Upper right playfield loop-the-house (which I'm guessing will make it spin like the tornado's got it the more you loop)
-Upper left playfield w/ Witch's castle
-Flying Monkey ball lock
-Kansas 'balloon' pop bumper in the left outlane
-Evil forest tree jumper bumpers (w/ LED lighting in their mouths/eyes)

Etc...I think the execution of the theme is going to be iconic/dark/epic - and the gameplay will be deep along the lines of Simpsons Pinball Party (same designers/programmer)
 
"gay" and "fruity stuff"?!?

yeah, i guess we really are back in the 80's.

vintage - check your man badge at the door; it's not working for me.
 
Great risk can bring great reward. Also, if he prices the 1000 home edition games right, he can stop from loosing his shirt. If they sell good, he will be fine on the lower priced operator versions.

6,500 x 1000 = 6,500,000.00. That's probably a reasonable cost for starting up a business and going into production. I really hope it goes well.

If it does, we are in for a run of great games from JJP and Stern. I'm excited to see what comes out at stern after Transformers, if it's the Ritchie/Sheats game.

I was planing to get MM and AFM in the next few years. I'm totally fine with waiting now. Good stuff indeed.
 
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