Why not just use AA lithium instead of button batteries?

JamesRobotron

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Why not just use AA lithium instead of button batteries?

I've always read about the AA battery to lithium button battery mod on Williams boards.
I know this may be a very basic question for some, but don't I get the same effect if I just put AA lithium batteries in the existing battery holders? No worries about leakage, correct? Do the lithium button batteries last longer?

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_...rl=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=aa+lithium
 
some people consider the single lithium cell more convenient I guess. I'm a proponent for remote AA holders like you would find on pinball machines, as it keeps it somewhat original.

the other thing to take into consideration when going lithium cell is that's only about 3 volts. three AA batteries at 1.5 volts each totals out to 4.5V. by design of the CMOS circuit, you immediately lose a half volt across the diodes before it reaches the CMOS chip. I read recently that anything about 2.0V to the CMOS chip is sufficient... but you lose out on a lot of juice going with the cell.

additionally, the larger Defender CMOS will rapidly drain the cell in just a matter of a few days or less (I would know... that's why a clean holder off one of the pins at work is going in my Defender is one of my priorities tonight :p )

as to why you don't use AA lithiums? I don't know, cost might another factor. you raise a pretty good question though. hopefully some others will chime in.
 
Batteries suck in general. Lithium batteries (coin or stick) is far less likely to leak that alkaline and nicad, but there is still a chance. Lithium batteries don't like moisture.

I might be bias, but NVRAM is the way to go. Never have to fuss with batteries again.
 
Batteries suck in general. Lithium batteries (coin or stick) is far less likely to leak that alkaline and nicad, but there is still a chance. Lithium batteries don't like moisture.

I might be bias, but NVRAM is the way to go. Never have to fuss with batteries again.


I agree, I used to use lithiums in eveything but now all my machines have nvram. One shot deal with a nvram. Install it and forget about it.
 
Agreed. NVRAM is the best solution.

Though this particular seller is MIA, his list gives you an idea of what likely is available.

https://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=319219

5101 module:
The 5101 module replaces 5101, 6501, and 2101 RAM chips.

Has on-board logic to properly decode both of the 5101 chip select lines.

Will work in many Bally-17, Bally-35, Williams Systems 3, 4, 6, 6a, and 7 systems. Email me using the link at the bottom of this page if you are not sure.

Also works in Omega Race.


6514 module:
The 6514 module replaces 5114, 5514, and 6514 RAM chips.

Will work on Williams machines such as Stargate, Sinistar, Robotron, Joust, Joust2, etc. (use the 5101 module for Defender).​
6116 module:
The 6116 module replaces 6116 RAM chips used on many Williams system 11 games.​
6264 module:
The 6264 module replaces 6264 and 2064 RAM chips used on many Williams and Data East boards.

Has on-board logic to properly decode both of the 6264 chip select lines.​
 
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My ZK boards are repaired and will be on their way back, but Mark has been out of NVRAMs for a while. So, I'll be using Energizer ultimate lithiums with a blocking diode for the time being.
 
Agreed. NVRAM is the best solution.

Though this particular seller is MIA, his list gives you an idea of what likely is available.

https://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=319219

5101 module:
The 5101 module replaces 5101, 6501, and 2101 RAM chips.

Has on-board logic to properly decode both of the 5101 chip select lines.

Will work in many Bally-17, Bally-35, Williams Systems 3, 4, 6, 6a, and 7 systems. Email me using the link at the bottom of this page if you are not sure.

Also works in Omega Race.


6514 module:
The 6514 module replaces 5114, 5514, and 6514 RAM chips.

Will work on Williams machines such as Stargate, Sinistar, Robotron, Joust, Joust2, etc. (use the 5101 module for Defender).​
6116 module:
The 6116 module replaces 6116 RAM chips used on many Williams system 11 games.​
6264 module:
The 6264 module replaces 6264 and 2064 RAM chips used on many Williams and Data East boards.

Has on-board logic to properly decode both of the 6264 chip select lines.​

Isn't that this product? I've used it.

http://lockwhenlit.com/anyPin.htm
 
Isn't that this product? I've used it.

http://lockwhenlit.com/anyPin.htm

While I have confidence that those will work okay, they do cost 3 to 4 times as much.

I bought Denikar's modules some time ago and was very happy with them. I've also purchased from PinForge <http://www.pinforge.com/>. The modules weren't cleaned after soldering (so I cleaned them myself) but they were inexpensive and worked well. The guy even sent me one extra module for free, a gift I guess. They worked well in my machines. My entire arcade is now running on NVRAM, no more batteries.

This is my list of machines that are using Denikar and Pinforge modules...

Jukebox 1991 Rowe CD100B
Pinball 1989 Bally Elvira and the Party Monsters
Pinball 1991 Williams Terminator 2
Williams Robotron
Williams Joust
Williams Defender

Bill B.
 
Nvram is an option, But the time and date will not be held with nvram.
 
Any game that uses a real time clock circuit is not going to advance with NVRAM when the power is turned off. In the pinball world that I am most familiar with, this really isnt a big deal. Very few games have time based features. The real time clock is notoriously inaccurate in WPC games too. Most games drift forward or back pretty fast.

For QIX and many of the arcade games I don't have access too, I am not sure if the NVRAM modules I sell work. They very well might. I had no idea my 6116 adapter worked in Pole Position until someone told me and then I started looking into other arcade games and sending out some samples for people to test.

I can probably tell if a NVRAM is going to work in a system with a scope image of the ram CE pin compared against the RW pin. If you look at the FM16W08 data sheet. They describe the timing needed and how it is different than a normal SRAM.

Omega Race and Defender for example use a different CE scheme. A 74HCT00 is used to invert CE2 and combine it with CE1 for proper timing. If you just whack the CE1 RAM to the FM16W08 NVRAM used, the board will not work.
 
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