What's a great 1st Pin to invest in ?

ctozzi

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I have many arcade games in my game-room and am very happy with the hobby. Like everyone else I get satisfied to easily and wanted to expand my collecting into the pinball world. I'm 35 and was looking for something relevant to my time that is very desired and hopefully will keep increasing in value as I add or change out down the road. I have never owned or operated a Pinball Machine so I would want something that is reasonably priced and was a good piece to learn the insides and outs on. Is something like Sopranos or Star Wars good one's for a 1st Pin ? My budget is enough to get just about anything within common reason, but obviously the less out of pocket the better. I also would probably need to ship the machine so any help on avoiding major issues there is welcomed as well. Thanks In Advance
Chris
 
I wouldn't buy a machine for an investment, unless you get something for a good price. If I were to "invest" I'd suggest some of the B-list machines. Look for games that are popular with lower production runs, because currently that hasn't really effected the value. I mean there are x7 more TAF then JM, but it's still 4-5 times more valueable. I would just buy something you enjoy and hope that you can sell it for a little bit more when you are ready to sell.
 
Pins are not for investing, they are for playing. If your not sure what you want, attend one of the pinball shows. That would be the best way to decide as there would be a wide variety in one place to compare.
 
I have many arcade games in my game-room and am very happy with the hobby. Like everyone else I get satisfied to easily and wanted to expand my collecting into the pinball world. I'm 35 and was looking for something relevant to my time that is very desired and hopefully will keep increasing in value as I add or change out down the road. I have never owned or operated a Pinball Machine so I would want something that is reasonably priced and was a good piece to learn the insides and outs on. Is something like Sopranos or Star Wars good one's for a 1st Pin ? My budget is enough to get just about anything within common reason, but obviously the less out of pocket the better. I also would probably need to ship the machine so any help on avoiding major issues there is welcomed as well. Thanks In Advance
Chris

All prices are based on my personal observation of asking prices, sale prices and general knowledge of the current market. These prices reflect a 100% working machine that is cosmetically good. I would consider these prices accurate for a title that is in above average condition.

Pinball Machines that I expect to continue to increase in value over the next 2-3 years.

1. Williams Medieval Madness -- current market price $8,000+.
2. Williams Cactus Canyon -- current market price $10,000+.
3. Capcom Big Bang Bar -- current market price $12,000+.
4. Stern Tron Legacy LE -- current market price is $7,000+
5. Stern Spiderman Black -- current market prics is $8,000+
6. Stern Lord Of The Rings -- current market price is $3,500+


Pinball Machines that I expect to rise and fall in value over the next 2-3 years. But they will remain near their current price points.

1. Williams Cirqus Voltaire -- current market price $4,500+
2. Williams Monster Bash -- current market price $4,500+
3. Stern Spiderman -- current market price $4,000+
4. Bally Attack From Mars -- current market price $4,000+
5. Bally Theatre of Magic -- current market price $3,800+
6. Stern Iron Man -- current market price of $3,800+
7. Stern Simpson's Pinball Party -- current market price of $3,000+
8. Williams White Water -- current market price of $3,000+
9. Stern Family Guy -- current market price of $3,000+

Now, some of the more modern Sterns such as Sopranos, World Poker Tour, Nascar, BBH, CSI, 24, Shrek could all be worth more in -3 years, but it's much tougher to forcast. The could easily be worth less.

With all of this said, I recommend that you find a pinball machine that you enjoy playing. Once found, buy it in working condition for typical market price. Use Boston Pinball, ebay, Mr Pinball, RGP, KLOV, etc as a guide to help determine a fair value.

When the time comes to sell it, I believe that you will be happy when you discover that your sale price will be pretty close to your original purchase price. It may be a litte less and it could be a little more. But my experience tells me that it all evens out in the end.

My 0.02.

Marcus
 
Your current market price for Attack From Mars is way low and it's market price will continue to increase as long as there is a waiting line to get one.
 
ok thanks guys, i'm gonna hit up the pinball hall of fame here in las vegas next week and see what i like 1st. I wasn't looking at this as a straight investment, but just don't want to drop $ 3500.00 then 2 years later its worth $ 2000. I am looking for something that will always be attractive to collectors in case I ever need to sell it. I am looking to collect myself but you never know what the future holds, so was leaning towards one that is highly desired.
THANKS
Chris
 
Your current market price for Attack From Mars is way low and it's market price will continue to increase as long as there is a waiting line to get one.

agreed, I must take at least 2 calls a day with people wanting to pay my $7500 price I have on the website that is until I remembered to take it off yesterday.

I could sell 8 of them at that price or higher within a week if I had them to sell.
 
"I'd suggest some of the B-list machines. Look for games that are popular with lower production runs"

Totally agree with this one. Games like JM, Shadow, WW are good examples IMO. The biggest thing is to do your homework, be patient and not overpay.
 
I would go to ipdb and look at whats the highest rated.. Go down the list until you find something you can afford/a theme you like.. Here are the top 25 SS pins(the list goes to 300).

There are many $3k or less pins on the list. One thing to consider is some pins like TZ is more complicated(harder to maintain) than something like T2.

1. 8.5[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1993[/SIZE] Twilight Zone [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]480 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.6[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.5[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.5[/SIZE] 2. 8.3[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1997[/SIZE] Medieval Madness [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]298 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.3[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.4[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.3[/SIZE] 3. 8.3[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1992[/SIZE] The Addams Family [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]358 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.2[/SIZE] 4. 8.3[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1993[/SIZE] Star Trek: The Next Generation [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]340 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.5[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.4[/SIZE] 5. 8.3[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1995[/SIZE] Theatre of Magic [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]239 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.3[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.1[/SIZE] 6. 8.3[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1997[/SIZE] Cirqus Voltaire [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]242 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.3[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.2[/SIZE] 7. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1996[/SIZE] Scared Stiff [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]158 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:7.9[/SIZE] 8. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1993[/SIZE] White Water [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]230 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.7[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.3[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.4[/SIZE] 9. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1995[/SIZE] Attack from Mars [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]209 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:7.9[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.2[/SIZE] 10. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1996[/SIZE] Tales of the Arabian Nights [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]172 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.8[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.0[/SIZE] 11. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1993[/SIZE] Indiana Jones: The Pinball Adventure [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]264 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.1[/SIZE] 12. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1998[/SIZE] Monster Bash [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]163 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.0[/SIZE] 13. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]2003[/SIZE] The Lord of the Rings [SIZE=-2]by Stern[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]277 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.3[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.3[/SIZE] 14. 8.2[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1990[/SIZE] Funhouse [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]241 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.9[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.3[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.2[/SIZE] 15. 8.1[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1992[/SIZE] Creature from the Black Lagoon [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]244 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.9[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.0[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:7.9[/SIZE] 16. 8.1[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1992[/SIZE] The Getaway: High Speed II [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]182 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:7.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.3[/SIZE] 17. 8.1[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]2003[/SIZE] The Simpsons Pinball Party [SIZE=-2]by Stern[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]180 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.1[/SIZE] 18. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1990[/SIZE] Whirlwind [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]129 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:7.7[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.2[/SIZE] 19. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]2007[/SIZE] Spider-Man [SIZE=-2]by Stern[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]140 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.7[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.2[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.1[/SIZE] 20. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1992[/SIZE] Fish Tales [SIZE=-2]by Williams[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]180 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:7.8[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:7.9[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.1[/SIZE] 21. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1998[/SIZE] Cactus Canyon [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]86 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:7.8[/SIZE] 22. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]2009[/SIZE] The Lord of the Rings (Limited Edition) [SIZE=-2]by Stern[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]22 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.1[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:7.8[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:7.8[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.0[/SIZE] 23. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1994[/SIZE] The Shadow [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]168 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.1[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:7.2[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.3[/SIZE] 24. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]2011[/SIZE] Transformers™ (Pro) [SIZE=-2]by Stern[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]15 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.3[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:7.9[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:7.9[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Fun:8.0[/SIZE] 25. 8.0[SIZE=-2]/10[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]1993[/SIZE] Judge Dredd [SIZE=-2]by Bally[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]136 ratings: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Audio:8.0[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Playfield:8.0[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Art:8.1[/SIZE]

here are the top 50 searches on mrpinball. People tend to look for what they want..

Top Fifty Machine Searches
1. Twilight Zone
2. Funhouse
3. Medieval Madness
4. Addams Family
5. Indiana Jones
6. Monster Bash
7. Black Knight
8. Star Trek
9. Attack From Mars
10. KISS
11. Simpsons
12. Star Wars
13. Cyclone
14. Haunted House
15. Theatre of Magic
16. Scared Stiff
17. Addams
18. Whitewater
19. Whirlwind
20. Creature
21. High Speed
22. Lord of The Rings
23. Playboy
24. Pinbot
25. Spiderman
26. Xenon
27. Fireball
28. Fish Tales
29. White Water
30. Fathom
31. Eight Ball Deluxe
32. Dracula
33. Firepower
34. Taxi
35. Centaur
36. Madness
37. Eight Ball
38. Getaway
39. Shadow
40. Gorgar
41. Black Hole
42. Paragon
43. Cactus Canyon
44. Cirqus Voltaire
45. Twilight
46. Diner
47. Earthshaker
48. Bingo
49. South Park
50. Monopoly
 
Thanks for all the info guys. Today I went to the Pinball Hall Of Fame here in Las Vegas, I played a few of the one's I was interested in and glad I did. T2 wasn't that fun compared to Lord Of The Rings, Pirates, Transformers, or Black Knight. I see these on ebay but they seem overly priced. I looked on the boston pinball site to gauge a general street price and can't seem to find these anywhere near their price lists. Is there any brokers who sell these for real world non inflated prices ? I'm leaning towards a LOTR/Transformers/Pirates machine. I'm going to go back this week again and play these all again to make my final decision.
Thanks
Chris
 
Thanks for all the info guys. Today I went to the Pinball Hall Of Fame here in Las Vegas, I played a few of the one's I was interested in and glad I did. T2 wasn't that fun compared to Lord Of The Rings, Pirates, Transformers, or Black Knight. I see these on ebay but they seem overly priced. I looked on the boston pinball site to gauge a general street price and can't seem to find these anywhere near their price lists. Is there any brokers who sell these for real world non inflated prices ? I'm leaning towards a LOTR/Transformers/Pirates machine. I'm going to go back this week again and play these all again to make my final decision.
Thanks
Chris

LOTR is one of the deepest rule set games you can buy. It will flat out piss you off to no end because of how hard it is. Very few people have made it to Valinor. I've had mine for ~3 years now and have yet to see Valinor. But this is a GOOD thing. It will keep you coming back time and time again. I have a few games that I can step up and beat almost everytime and I still enjoy them. But the games do lose the allure because of how simple they are. When you get good enough at LOTR you can have 30-45 minute game times so it is nice to have something "simple" to get a quick game or two in.

Can't comment on Transformers - never played one.
 
I also want to go play twilight zone and adams family to see why they are rated so high as fun factor. This is going to be played not just by me so the " fun " factor is important .
 
I also want to go play twilight zone and adams family to see why they are rated so high as fun factor. This is going to be played not just by me so the " fun " factor is important .

And you'll learn real quick the average "Joe" doesn't understand pinball. So the more complicated the less likely they are to enjoy it. But if it were me I would NEVER buy a pin to appease anyone but myself. Nothing worse than owning a game that you don't play but keep it because everyone else likes it.

Addams is awesome. Pinheads and non pinheads alike tend to like this game. And the nice thing about buying A list pins is when you tire of them you can generally trade them straight across for another A list pin.

TZ isn't a real good pin for the average Joe. It's too complicated and doesn't give stuff for doing next to nothing. Most people think pinball is awesome when they hit multi balls right and left. For a pinhead it's an irritance :)
 
I have not seen a guide that had accurate prices. Don't trust any guide. Look at what they sell for on ebay. You can't get a better estimate of what a pin is worth by what people pay for them.
 
Which is why this is such a great guide:

http://www.bostonpinball.biz/05262008.htm

If you ignore the minimum, and only conisder the high and average, that guide would be ok.

I sold my defender pin for more than $1500..

good luck finding a TZ for $3k..

varkon $2600?
CFBL $2500?
High speed 2 $1395?
pinball magic $1649?
sttng $2200?
white water $1648?
 
In a nutshell:

If the game is an A or B list WMS, Bally or newer Stern in decent cosmetic condition, it will command a premium price for a while. I had this discussion with a customer the other day who bought many games from me 5 years ago. It is simple supply and demand. The supply of these used games is FINITE... none will ever be made again, and thus supply will either stagnate or decrease (more likely decrease). The demand is increasing as new buyers become more interested and enter the "hobby". Demand is not increasing as fast as it once was, but it is, coupled with a decrease in the finite supply.

Pinball economics 101.

-Mike
 
I don't think I'd suggest TZ as a first machine. It's a great game, but probably not the best for a first machine. Although if you only want to have one machine maybe. Really just buy something you love. If you love it and pay a fair price there will always be others who love it.

Someone also mentioned WPT as a game they are not sure about. Of the newer Stern games I think it is currently the best buy for gameplay vs price. Not my favorite theme, but a solid machine.
 
here are the top 50 searches on mrpinball. People tend to look for what they want..

sure, but that's a biased search - people also tend to look for what they can afford. like, i'd love a MM, but i know i can't afford it, so i'd never search for it.

one resource i really like is the pinside "bang for your buck" list - the machines that won't cost you an arm and a leg that are fairly highly rated. http://pinside.com/pinball/top-100/bangforbuck
 
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