Turkey Shoot - Graphics Issue

jetusenet

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I am very happy to announce that I have finally played my first game of Turkey Shoot - since the 80s' - Saturday night, on my very own, 90% working, Turkey Shoot!

I have been working on this game, off and on for what must be over a year. With the help of Andre, who traced my problem to the Special Chip and also reversed my 4164 MOD - It appears that the MOD cannot be done on the TS boardset, at least not the way that I did it.

The only problem now, (functioning wise) is that the signs on the buildings are not displaying properly - has any one else seen this??
 

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rom rot? a fresh set of roms couldnt hurt.. could be some other issue or something related to your mod, who knows lol i aint no board expert....
 
The ROMs are all in good condition as well as the sockets. I have an extra set which I could start swapping out, one by one but as the "test" does not show any RAM, ROM or CMOS errors, I think that it might be a different problem but I don't know for sure.
I was hoping someone else had a similar problem which led to a specific fault.
I am also receiving a code during start up, 1-2-0 and the manual states that a RAM error would be displayed by a readout of 100 to 199 but the manual has no reference to a 1-2-0 code.
Are there any TS owners that can confirm that this a "normal" readout during start-up?
Thanks
Jeff
 
I would have to disassemble the ROMs to verify the startup code, but several games from that era at Williams only tested the code ROMs. The image ROMs were not tested because it was a PIA having to build the checksums just to change a single image.

If you have a ROM burner, dump the set of ROMs and verify the whole set against the corresponding MAME set.

ken
 
That makes sense as the tests come up "all systems go".
I was hoping that someone had a similar problem with the graphics that could point me to the offending ROM, otherwise I'll have to start swapping........
I checked the manual to see if I could at the least, isolate the image ROMs. The RAM error codes are printed but not the ROM error codes, too bad because if they were, I could assume that they were the program ROMs and I could leave those alone.
I'll give it some more time as I have numerous other projects going, (as everyone else!) and during the meantime, if anyone could help me detirmine which ROMs are the image vs. program, I would be deeply grateful.
Jeff
 
Kevin;
Thank you very much for that info and link!!
I'll be trying this today and hopefully one (or two/three) of those will take care of my graphics problem.
Jeff
 
Please pardon my stupidity - I have been very tired lately... (3 children AND a wife!)......
I checked the ROM summary in the manual to see where ROMs 19, 20 and 21 resided and there I saw the ROM error codes, exactly where I had seen them a million times before DUH!
They are listed as the "vertlines" ROMs and do not have an error code associated with them which backs up the theory that the graphics ROMs do not have checksums and therefore cannot be tested during boot.
I hope that this theory proves true and I have a 100% working game by Tuesday AM.
Fingers crossed and shoelaces tied.
Jeff
 
BAD NEWS (for me)
No go on the ROM swap, still have the same issue.
I replaced 19, 20 and 21 with new, freshly burned and have the same display.
I am dreading replacing, one by one, all the others, is there anyone out there that can help?!?!?
Waaaaaaa!
Thanks
Jeff
 
No, I have not.....
Some other things that I have noiticed as well is that the Grenade button does not always light when a Grenade is available and sometimes I do not have rapid fire during the bonus round.
Everything else seems to be OK with the exception of the graphics issue, (signs messed up).
What is really strange is that I have another boardset that has the exact same issue with the graphics?!?!?
There is something that I am missing and hopefully - eventually - I WILL figure this out.
If you have any ideas, please let me know and maybe we can figure this out.
Jeff
 
hi jeff

i read the other thread seems like we must be the only turkey shoot owners in the world which is cool but doesn't really help us.

can you confirm that you have tried a new set of roms on both the boards? my roms layout is the same as yours with rom 18 soldered in.

i've moved the ram chips around to see if the error would move no change so ruled out Dram.

i am now thinking about replacing all the ic's that arn't soldered in i checked my other boards to see if there's any that i can borrow with no luck so will have to order some will take a while as i'm in NZ and some ic's are pretty rare.

i have a few more questions as i'm thinking of restoring my one as its in pretty poor shape.

is the t-moulding textured or smooth gone old with winkles?

my monitor has a smaller image than the screen size is this normal?

have you had the glass out? i want to clean inbetween the 2 planes.

know of any repro control panels?

cheers jeff
chin up sure we'll sort it out even if i have to pay someone :(
 
I know for a fact that we are not the only TS owners but it sure feels like it!

I purchased a complete set of ROMs to troubleshoot with and receive the same corrupted graphics using the original set or the "fresh" set. In fact I have 2 boardsets and have the same graphics issue on both boardsets using the original or new ROMs........ It make me think that there is something wrong with the cabinet but how could that effect the operation of the game??

I don't think it is the RAM as I have a complete new set of 4116 in both both boardsets.....

I tried swapping the special chips to see if the problem moves but it did not. I have to do a spreadsheet with the "movable" chips and make sure I try all combination's.

BTW, I swapped all the PROMs, as I had a set of those made as well and still have the same issues......

The tee molding on my game is textured, I have begun to restore the cab, as I need to take a break from the electronics of it all, and finished the bottom front. It came out really nice! Next is the interior cleanup and painting, waxing of the side art, (preservation) and swapping of the control panels, I have a spare with 95% perfect overlay but I'll have to swap the optics etc as the good CP does not have the "gutz"..

The monitor should be adjusted using the cross hatch pattern, same as other games, to fill the entire screen.

I have flaking on the bezel so that is need of repair. I was thinking of my options and I think for now, I am going to take the bezel apart and "melt" whats left of the original back onto the glass, then use gloss black to make up for what is missing, that is until someone does a repo (hint hint Rich ;-)

I also bought new fans for the feather feature but will have to replace the feathers first as well as they are over 25 years old and look like it!

As I am now onto my Space Wars monitor troubleshooting, until that enigma has been solved, the TS will have to wait. I can still play it, albeit with the bad signage but it is better than nothing.

Peace
Jeff
 
new turkey shoot owner

I acquired a Turkey Shoot this past week that's been sitting idle in a closed gas station for 10 years or so. Looks like someone updated it to a switching power supply. After checking out voltages and continuity I turned the game on but I'm getting a wonky boot that never gets anywhere. The LED display on the PCB appears to repeat 1-8-1-8-1-8 and so on and so on over and over. There's neck glow and some sound on the monitor, so it's definitely not dead in the water... here's a quick video snip of that:

https://twitter.com/90minutetape/status/584524704079282176

I'm thinking about cleaning and reseating all of the socketed chips and looking over the board to see if there's any cold solder cracks and doing some reflowing. Any other advice? I'm excited to join the club (hopefully!).
 
Voltages, connections, IC's seated properly, etc.
I wish I could help more.......

So I held off cleaning my RAM until this morning. When slumped out of bed and did pull a couple chips out the legs were super scorched and *extremely* fragile. I mean, last night I'd pulled all the other chips on the PCB that were in sockets and had absolutely no problem cleaning and reseating those, but these lil' suckers were fragile and practically fell apart in my hands. I have no idea if they'd been abused by an Op earlier or they just suck in general. These are 4116 DRAM and are apparently massively prone to failure. 4164 conversion of a Turkey Shoot, then? Or throw new 4116s at them?

And JetUseNet, your last post on this subject ends un-concluded. Is that ominous?

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=72350&page=2
 
The 4116 RAM gets baked and the sockets suffer as well. I replaced all the RAM and sockets, also installed the NVRAM.

I tried 4164 but from what I remember, the mod would not work. I had to switch back to 4116. I tried to take a look to confirm but the game is boxed in and I cannot see the RAM bank from the coin door opening, it is behind the monitor.

Maybe I will be able to clear out the area and confirm but that won't be until ~Tuesday, it is really buried.

From personal experience, if the legs on the RAM are that discolored and brittle, it is time to replace them all. I would also replace the RAM sockets as well. That would be the best way to start and that work will only make the boards more resilient anyway.
 
The 4116 RAM gets baked and the sockets suffer as well. I replaced all the RAM and sockets, also installed the NVRAM.

I tried 4164 but from what I remember, the mod would not work. I had to switch back to 4116. I tried to take a look to confirm but the game is boxed in and I cannot see the RAM bank from the coin door opening, it is behind the monitor.

Maybe I will be able to clear out the area and confirm but that won't be until ~Tuesday, it is really buried.

From personal experience, if the legs on the RAM are that discolored and brittle, it is time to replace them all. I would also replace the RAM sockets as well. That would be the best way to start and that work will only make the boards more resilient anyway.

Yes, they are totally brittle. Okay, any other advice as far as where to buy the right memory? My chips are Fujitsu MB8116E chips. I can't really figure out what the other numbers below it represent (production dates?). I'm going to find either more MB8116E chips from Fujitsu or I'll try to find a match on this 4116 datasheet. Sound like a plan or am I way off?

http://www.minuszerodegrees.net/memory/4116/4116_list_1.pdf
 
There was a Gentleman selling bulk RAM IC's (4116 and 4164) here on KLOV.
Do a search and you'll get a bunch for a great deal.
Jeff
 
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