bheineck
Well-known member
I gotta say, if people ordered stuff and then backed out, they are lame and I'd be pissed about that too. Prepay is the way to go for big cost runs of things like this so back outs are never an issue.
sw/esb kits
- Thread starter tron guy
- Start date
Mark may have a certain way about him, however, he is a great help in the community. I have no clue why he's no longer around though. He has always treated me with respect, produced products that others did not, and has always kept his word with me. Plus, he ships FAST! 
Mark may have a certain way about him, however, he is a great help in the community. I have no clue why he's no longer around though. He has always treated me with respect, produced products that others did not, and has always kept his word with me. Plus, he ships FAST!
Because he was banned for about 3+ months.
g3n3r1c
Permanently Banned
So,
I personally have never dealt with Mark. I do however have to say that it seems like he is getting a lot of shit for someone that, albeit in an eccentric way, contributes to our little
community.
I personally have never dealt with Mark. I do however have to say that it seems like he is getting a lot of shit for someone that, albeit in an eccentric way, contributes to our little
community.
Mark may have a certain way about him, however, he is a great help in the community. I have no clue why he's no longer around though. He has always treated me with respect, produced products that others did not, and has always kept his word with me. Plus, he ships FAST!
He's not around because the admin/moderators here decided it was best that he be banned. See, Mark's personality tends to get him in trouble here where adults act like children and respond accordingly.
I don't have a problem with people who have dealt with him and have issues with him expressing their opinions. I do have a problem with newbs who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground talking trash when they don't have a clue.
Big Arn
Member
I agree that Mark is an asset to this collecting community.
He has been contributing for a LONG time -- I remember him back in the RGVAC days.
He has always treated me fairly as well, and has provided top notch products and information.
-- Bruce
He has been contributing for a LONG time -- I remember him back in the RGVAC days.
He has always treated me fairly as well, and has provided top notch products and information.
-- Bruce
bheineck
Well-known member
ChadTower
Active member
The problem with prepay is that people either run off with the money or they don't deliver on the promised timeframe. People get tired of waiting on a product for a year or more after the delivery date. Preorder just puts the risk all on the buyer when really if you're going to be a businessperson the risk is on you. It shouldn't be on the customer.
Mark doesn't take preorders and I agree with the practice. Unfortunately in this hobby people don't feel obligated to purchase a product they signed up for and for which the seller laid out their capital. Yeah, his online manners tend to feel like an Eminem song, but I have yet to see him rip anyone off. I have seen him lay out thousands of dollars in capital only to have nobody pony up the funds when the product is ready. These things go both ways.
Dave @ RAM screwed the community bigtime when it comes to PRE-PAYMENT. Someone coined the term the "RAM EFFECT"... and it's true. It only takes one P.O.S. screwing the community to make folks sour on the idea of pre-pay.
bheineck
Well-known member
Most people making things here are not running a business though (at least not without a normal job as well). To ask a talented hobbyist to cough up $3K-$4K on a chance of profit is not very reasonable and would severely limit the offerings of things available here. This is not a group of budding entrepreneurs. Besides, don't pretty much all people prepay for everything bought here? I don't recall every receiving anything here before I paid. I think if the seller has good feedback and references its all good for prepay. I hardly think it is the norm that "people either run off with the money or they don't deliver on the promised timeframe", otherwise why would anyone be a member here? I do agree it is a risk though, but every deal has risk of some sort. Anyone who commits to buy something here when someone has put out a bunch of their cash based on that commitment and then does not buy it, is scum (barring serious personal catastrophe of course). Not attacking, just my thoughts on what a no prepay KLOV would be like (Very limited offerings).
bheineck
Well-known member
Yeah I have to imagine that screwing is a hard one to recover from. I didn't get nailed by that, but I can certainly sympathize with those who did and understand their reluctance at prepay. I just think without it, not as many products would be available to the community and it does far more harm to us to not accept it than the largely abnormal situation of a guy running off with a bunch of buyer's cash. This Mark not selling here anymore is a good example of what not having prepay can do. I mean it is a noble gesture to front the cash, but I think Mark could care less about that nobility now. Takeman makes a bunch of nice CPs for people here and is pretty much all prepay, but I would rather prepay than not have him contribute this awesome service.
ChadTower
Active member
The moment you ask 25 people to pony up three figures each for a product you intend to produce you become a businessperson. Claiming otherwise just doesn't hold water as a practice either ethically or legally. It's an unusual phenomenon that it happens here so often.
If the people who commit to buying, and then don't buy, are scum then there is an awful lot of scumbags wandering around this place.
If the people who commit to buying, and then don't buy, are scum then there is an awful lot of scumbags wandering around this place.
I, for one, am happy to pre-pay for certain items from certain people. I didn't get screwed by Dave because I saw him for what he is oh, about FOUR YEARS AGO... but I see the (RAM)effect that had on the hobby...
bheineck
Well-known member
I agree RAM was a business, but the esb kit in this example is $200 and cannot be successfully compared to the RAM fiasco and asking for thousands of dollars up front. Scumbag David Adams could have easily said "cockpits are all done! Order yours from our website in the next 4 days and they are 40% off." People would have swamped him with cash which he could then run off with and he would have not made everyone "prepay". A theif is a theif is a theif and he will figure out how to get your money, prepay or not. I don't think prepay is the issue.
I don't know how often this backing out happens, but if it is that rampant then prepay is really the only answer or talented people just won't make things available to the community.
And yes, all who back out after someone counting on that commitment have put up their own cash are scum (aforementioned exclusion)!
I don't know how often this backing out happens, but if it is that rampant then prepay is really the only answer or talented people just won't make things available to the community.
And yes, all who back out after someone counting on that commitment have put up their own cash are scum (aforementioned exclusion)!
Backing out
People back out of runs more than you'd wanna know.. As I've got a few close friends who have produced kits in the past, and have had to eat a majority of the costs.. It amazes me how many people will say they are "in" on a post.. But when it comes to paying for the product, they disappear.. Heh, producing arcade products has got to be for the love
People back out of runs more than you'd wanna know.. As I've got a few close friends who have produced kits in the past, and have had to eat a majority of the costs.. It amazes me how many people will say they are "in" on a post.. But when it comes to paying for the product, they disappear.. Heh, producing arcade products has got to be for the love
Mark
Mark Speath is an asset to the community and also a very good friend of mine.. Yes, his online tact is a wee bit eccentric and sometimes abusive, but all in all he's a good man.. Known him for over 15 years and he's been a stand up guy the whole time.. Heh, I just don't agree with his methods of communication
Mark Speath is an asset to the community and also a very good friend of mine.. Yes, his online tact is a wee bit eccentric and sometimes abusive, but all in all he's a good man.. Known him for over 15 years and he's been a stand up guy the whole time.. Heh, I just don't agree with his methods of communication
Yep
Yep, I have been buddies with him Scott.. Why do you care? Oh, is it that time of the year again when you start in on me again? It's been awhile, for some reason I thought you had moved on.. Guess not. You must be lonely
Yep, I have been buddies with him Scott.. Why do you care? Oh, is it that time of the year again when you start in on me again? It's been awhile, for some reason I thought you had moved on.. Guess not. You must be lonely
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