Star Wars Amplifone HV help

SaminVA

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I need some help with my Star Wars Amplifone monitor.Here's a little background.
http://members.cox.net/sverlander/Star_Wars_project_page.html
Back in 2001 I got my Star Wars working. I found a working board set, rebuilt the Amplifone deflection board and HV board and installed a new Wintron HV transformer. I had no problems with the game, only used it a couple times a year so it hasn't had much time on it sense the rebuild. Two years ago during a 4th of July party, I coined up a game and put the cross hairs on easy game and pulled the fire button and the game died, just went completely dead. I checked it over and found the main fuse F1 a 7 amp slow blow fuse had blown. I didn't have a 7 amp so I put a 6 amp slow blow in expecting it to blow but it didn't. The game came to life but it appeared it was watch dogging as the monitor was blinking on and off but it was displaying game graphics and spiting out some sounds. I turned the game off and put it in storage where it's been for the last 2 years. At the time I didn't think to put it in test mode and see what would happen.
With the new Vector Labs SW/ESB kit due to hit the market I decided it was time to get my Star Wars up and running. First thing I did was check the voltages on the A/R board and at the main board set. when I turned it on the game was dead. The led on the deflection board was on so I figured the board was dead. All the voltages were their but the 5 volt was low, 4.75volts so I decided to go though the power block check all the fuses, connectors and replace Big Blue because it still had the original because at the time Bob Roberts was sold out but I had ordered one not to long ago anticipating fixing my game. I installed the new Big Blue which is now black and tested all the fuses and fuse holders and made sure they had the correct values. Put it all back in and adjusted the 5 volts but the game was still dead. I then pulled the board set, pulled, cleaned and reinserted all the IC chips and cleaned all the edge connections and tried it again this time I was greeted with 16 hi pitched beeps wile in test mode but nothing on the screen. The led on the deflection board was now off and it sounds like I have deflection chatter but no hi voltage. I put the game back in game mode and it plays blind. I noticed the HV heat sink BU406D and the wintron transformer were getting hot so I cut the game off. I pulled the HV board and put it on the work bench and pulled the BU406D and tested it with my DVM and it checked out good. I even compared it to a new one and it had almost the exact same readings. With the BU406D removed from the board I hooked it back up to the deflection board so I could make the voltage checks as listed in the amplifone FAQ. I had both the + and - 30 volts coming into the HV board from the deflection board. I then checked the +24 and -24 regulators and got +27 and -24 volts so I decided to install a new BU406D and give it another try. I did check pin 3 of the 555 chip with my logic probe and had a pulse so that appears to be working. Fired it back up and still no HV. I rechecked the voltages now that I had the BU406D installed and my + and - 30 volts was OK but when I checked the + and - 24 volt regulators the - 24 volts was fine but I only have + 12 volts on the + 24 volt line. Could this be the problem? I guess it's time to replace the regulators and test everything listed in the FAQ. I also noticed I have no neck glow. Please dont tell me my Wintron is dead. :eek:
Anyone else got any ideas
Thanks for any help.
 
Would be worth checking the 50 ohm resistor on the side with the 12v instead of 24. Are the caps good on the HV board?

yep good call, the 50 ohm resistor looks good, no burns but it's open so it's bad but will this cause no hi voltage? I thought this was just a protection add on and would work without it. I still plain to change the 24 volt regulators. I installed these back in 2002 and they are the 1.5 amp CV version and that's when I installed a cap kit. It's had very few hours running sense I first fixed it.
Any other ideas?
 
yep good call, the 50 ohm resistor looks good, no burns but it's open so it's bad but will this cause no hi voltage? I thought this was just a protection add on and would work without it. I still plain to change the 24 volt regulators. I installed these back in 2002 and they are the 1.5 amp CV version and that's when I installed a cap kit. It's had very few hours running sense I first fixed it.
Any other ideas?

Ok the open 50 ohm resistor is the one on the -24volt regulator. The 50 ohm resistor on the +24 volt side is OK but That's the side I am only gettinng +12 volts insread of the +24 volts. :confused:
 
Without 6.3VAC going to the neck, and the glow present, you won't see a picture, even if HV is present. If your transformer (flyback) isn't putting out the 6.3VAC any longer, you can tap into the 6.3VAC that goes to the coin door as a substitute. There are two wires from the iso transformer block that feed the voltage to the light bulbs at the coin door. One is blue, and I believe the other is blue and white. Tap into them with new wires, and connect one to the WHT HTR connection, and the other to the brown wire connection next to it.

This might not be the only problem going on, but I guarantee you that without 6.3VAC and neck glow, all other repairs will not produce a picture. I'm fresh off of a Star Wars Amp rebuild, so this stuff is still fresh in my mind.

Hope this helps.

Blaine
 
Without 6.3VAC going to the neck, and the glow present, you won't see a picture, even if HV is present. If your transformer (flyback) isn't putting out the 6.3VAC any longer, you can tap into the 6.3VAC that goes to the coin door as a substitute. There are two wires from the iso transformer block that feed the voltage to the light bulbs at the coin door. One is blue, and I believe the other is blue and white. Tap into them with new wires, and connect one to the WHT HTR connection, and the other to the brown wire connection next to it.

This might not be the only problem going on, but I guarantee you that without 6.3VAC and neck glow, all other repairs will not produce a picture. I'm fresh off of a Star Wars Amp rebuild, so this stuff is still fresh in my mind.

Hope this helps.

Blaine

Thanks for the reply, I did read your thread and followed your progress, That's my next step, check my tube pins to see if the filament is good and check all the connections going to it. I have a Wintron flyback but I don't know if it should always output the filament voltage or if something else on the HV board would keep it from out putting the voltage. I hate to think my Wintron is bad but with my luck it probably is.:rolleyes:
 
What exactly did you do when you rebuilt it ? Did you replace anything besides the caps, bu406d, and regulators ?

Back in 2002 when I got the Star Wars I replaced all the caps that came in a Bob Roberts cap kit, the 4 bottle cap transistors on the deflection board. I replaced both the 24 volt regulators on the HV board with the 1.5 amp version and I replaced the red flyback with a new Wintron and it was working great till it blew the F1 fuse in the power brick. I have the + and - 30 volts from the deflection board. The -24 volts seems OK but I only have 12 volts from the +24 volt regulator. I have no neck glow but I haven't tested the filament resistance or for 6.3 volt AC filament voltage. Can you measure the 6.3 AC off the wintron? I also have not checked for the 180volt B+ The 50 ohm resistor on the -24volt reg is open but the 50 ohm resistor on the +24volt reg is OK. I did put a new BU406D in it today even though the old one tested good but it made no difference. I can hear deflection chatter but have no Hi voltage.Any ideas on what to check next?
 
Back in 2002 when I got the Star Wars I replaced all the caps that came in a Bob Roberts cap kit, the 4 bottle cap transistors on the deflection board. I replaced both the 24 volt regulators on the HV board with the 1.5 amp version and I replaced the red flyback with a new Wintron and it was working great till it blew the F1 fuse in the power brick. I have the + and - 30 volts from the deflection board. The -24 volts seems OK but I only have 12 volts from the +24 volt regulator. I have no neck glow but I haven't tested the filament resistance or for 6.3 volt AC filament voltage. Can you measure the 6.3 AC off the wintron? I also have not checked for the 180volt B+ The 50 ohm resistor on the -24volt reg is open but the 50 ohm resistor on the +24volt reg is OK. I did put a new BU406D in it today even though the old one tested good but it made no difference. I can hear deflection chatter but have no Hi voltage.Any ideas on what to check next?

I have just rebuilt a HV board

At first I had no HV, and the overvolt light was ON

I turned the freq pot and the HV pot down counter-clockwise. The manual says turn the machine off and on again to reset the over volt state

Then adjust the freq to 20 khz (by memory) and set the HV to 19.5kv

So, is the Overvolt light on the HV board ON?

Secondly, 16 beeps is normal I think, It's telling you to press the aux coin up button inside the coin door

Have you got a freq meter and a HV probe?
 
I have just rebuilt a HV board

At first I had no HV, and the overvolt light was ON

I turned the freq pot and the HV pot down counter-clockwise. The manual says turn the machine off and on again to reset the over volt state

Then adjust the freq to 20 khz (by memory) and set the HV to 19.5kv

So, is the Overvolt light on the HV board ON?

Secondly, 16 beeps is normal I think, It's telling you to press the aux coin up button inside the coin door

Have you got a freq meter and a HV probe?

The game plays blind now after I reseated all the IC's. The led on the deflection board is now off. The Led on the Hi Voltage board is off. I can hear deflection chatter. I have no neck glow and no Hi Voltage. The BU406D and the Wintron transformer gets hot. I am starting to think the Wintron is dead.
No I dont have a HV probe or freq meter.
 
The game plays blind now after I reseated all the IC's. The led on the deflection board is now off. The Led on the Hi Voltage board is off. I can hear deflection chatter. I have no neck glow and no Hi Voltage. The BU406D and the Wintron transformer gets hot. I am starting to think the Wintron is dead.
No I dont have a HV probe or freq meter.

Has the 24v problem been fixed? It will need to be

The 6.3v to the heater needs to be present too, but the way the heater gets it's 6.3v is from a coil of wire around the HVT core, so if there is no HV there is no 6.3.

The other night I was experimenting on my amp and noticed the heater voltage was way too high at 12VAC, (new HVT from bob roberts) so I de-soldered the 2 twisted brown wires from the HV Board and rigged it up to a 6V AC Transformer I found in the shed. I powered up the machine first then the new transformer, and measured a steady 6VAC, and the machine worked great.

Then out of interest I turned off the makeshift transformer and slowly the picture faded away.

By the way, how do you know you have no HV?

Mine runs with NO static, and yet it runs.

Anyway the +24VDC needs to be fixed and the 6.3VAC will probably re-appear

Good luck with the 24v
 
Has the 24v problem been fixed? It will need to be

The 6.3v to the heater needs to be present too, but the way the heater gets it's 6.3v is from a coil of wire around the HVT core, so if there is no HV there is no 6.3.

The other night I was experimenting on my amp and noticed the heater voltage was way too high at 12VAC, (new HVT from bob roberts) so I de-soldered the 2 twisted brown wires from the HV Board and rigged it up to a 6V AC Transformer I found in the shed. I powered up the machine first then the new transformer, and measured a steady 6VAC, and the machine worked great.

Then out of interest I turned off the makeshift transformer and slowly the picture faded away.

By the way, how do you know you have no HV?

Mine runs with NO static, and yet it runs.

Anyway the +24VDC needs to be fixed and the 6.3VAC will probably re-appear

Good luck with the 24v

Well like you say I need to figure out what's up with the +24 volts. Then check out the Filament in the tube to make sure its good then I could wire it up to the 6 volt coin light circuit and see if that works. I say I don't have Hi voltage now because their's no spark at the anode cap when I try to discharge it. I can test everything on the board except the fly back and the MC1.
 
Did you change the brown jumper wire out ? Also, try measuring your B+ just for the heck of it. You can measure it at the deflection board where the purple wire goes in from the HV board . The black next to it is ground or just clip on the dag spring. Speaking of the dag spring, is it plugged in ? Do you have continuity from the dag spring to the ground on your HV board ? Check that too.
 
Did you change the brown jumper wire out ? Also, try measuring your B+ just for the heck of it. You can measure it at the deflection board where the purple wire goes in from the HV board . The black next to it is ground or just clip on the dag spring. Speaking of the dag spring, is it plugged in ? Do you have continuity from the dag spring to the ground on your HV board ? Check that too.

Yes the brown jumper was changed with a solid wire.
Yes, I am gonna replace the + - 24 volt regulators and try it again and see if the B + is on the purple wire , that's one I did not check. Yes the Dag spring is correct and the wire is soldered to it and plugged in. I'll check continuity from the dag spring to the ground on the HV board to but I think everything is correct. What ever caused the F1 fuse to blow must have caused the problem in the monitor. Just hope it's not the Wintron but If I have to I'll try one of Bob Roberts replacements.
Thanks guys for the help
 
The 50 ohm resistor needs replacing first, they basically help the regulator by allowing some of the load to pass from Vin to Vout. If the Wintron us bad drop me a Pm and I will send you a free drop in replacement if you cover the postage. Good luck.
 
The 50 ohm resistor needs replacing first, they basically help the regulator by allowing some of the load to pass from Vin to Vout. If the Wintron us bad drop me a Pm and I will send you a free drop in replacement if you cover the postage. Good luck.

For sure. That should be the first thing.
 
Ok I got a little good news and a lot of bad news. First the good. I checked pins 9 and 10 of my pic tube and I have 1.9 ohms so I think the filament should be OK.
Now for the bad news.
I replaced both the 24 volt regulators and both 1n4001 diodes even though the old ones tested good and yes I put them in the correct way. I replaced the 50 ohm resistor with one of the square ceramic ones from radio shack. Doesn't look pretty but I figured it would work for testing until I could get better replacements. Checked everything out and connected all the plugs back up and fired it up. I first checked for the 6.3 volt filament voltage off the gray wire of the wintron and I got no voltage. I then checked the + - 30 volts and they were both a little low, +28 _28 volts then I checked the -24 volts and it was OK but the + 24 volts was only at 12.98 volts so I then started to check the B+ on the purple wire coming off the deflection board plug and before I could their was a big puff of smoke off the HV board. I cut power and it looks like the new + 24 volt regulator has blown apart. Could a bad fly back cause this? I am about to give up.:004_ssad:
 
Ok I got a little good news and a lot of bad news. First the good. I checked pins 9 and 10 of my pic tube and I have 1.9 ohms so I think the filament should be OK.
Now for the bad news.
I replaced both the 24 volt regulators and both 1n4001 diodes even though the old ones tested good and yes I put them in the correct way. I replaced the 50 ohm resistor with one of the square ceramic ones from radio shack. Doesn't look pretty but I figured it would work for testing until I could get better replacements. Checked everything out and connected all the plugs back up and fired it up. I first checked for the 6.3 volt filament voltage off the gray wire of the wintron and I got no voltage. I then checked the + - 30 volts and they were both a little low, +28 _28 volts then I checked the -24 volts and it was OK but the + 24 volts was only at 12.98 volts so I then started to check the B+ on the purple wire coming off the deflection board plug and before I could their was a big puff of smoke off the HV board. I cut power and it looks like the new + 24 volt regulator has blown apart. Could a bad fly back cause this? I am about to give up.:004_ssad:

Which HV board do you have? A201012-01 or A201012-02? (Printed on parts side)

Something is shorted and dragging the voltage down
 
Which HV board do you have? A201012-01 or A201012-02? (Printed on parts side)

Something is shorted and dragging the voltage down

On the parts side it has A201012 , on the solder side it has 201013-01
I have installed another 24 volt regulator and removed the BU406D and I am gonna put it back in and check the voltages again. Looking at the schematic it's starting to look like the Wintron is shorted , that's if my voltages are ok with the BU406D removed as it is getting hot so the current must be passing though it.
I'll try it and get back.
 

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Ok I fired it up with the BU406D removed and everything was running cool. Nothing exploded. I checked the + and - 30 volts coming from the deflection board and I am getting +33 and -33 volts. Next I checked the 24 volt regulators. Before I was getting - 24 volts but the 50 ohm resistor was open. Now that I have a new 50 ohm resistor installed I am getting - 32 volts. On the +24 volts before I was getting + 27 volts and now I am getting about the same +27-28 volts. So that means nothing on the board is now loading down the +24 volt regulator. It had to be something shorting though the BU406D because it was getting hot when it was installed and it tests good so that leaves the wintron transformer. Does that sound right or am I missing something.
 
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