Soldering Iron Temperature?

[MaximRecoil]

That's an awesome blurb. Thanks for posting it!
(one day, I too will have a Metcal rig....sigh...)

No problem.

I learned to solder on a Metcal, and was professionally trained (I worked at a PCB factory for 2 years, soldering about 1,000 boards per night). I know the style of tip we used (STTC-X26 for most everything, from through-hole terminal blocks to tiny surface-mount components), but I don't remember if it was an STTC-026 (600°F) or STTC-126 (700°F). If it was the 600 degree tip, then they definitely worked well, given that it was an assembly line and we soldered about 65 to 75 joints per minute. We used no-clean solder, so it wouldn't surprise me if they were 600 degree tips. I wish I would have saved one of the dozens of tips I threw away while working there, or at least one of the packages they came it, for reference.

At home I used a $7 Radio Shack iron for a while, which really sucked; but I kept watching eBay for a good deal on a used Metcal, and I finally got one a couple years ago. Once you use one, I doubt you'll want to go back to anything else.

 

[cwilkson]

At home I used a $7 Radio Shack iron for a while, which really sucked; but I kept watching eBay for a good deal on a used Metcal, and I finally got one a couple years ago. Once you use one, I doubt you'll want to go back to anything else.

Radio Suck irons....suck. Weller makes good quality, reliable irons. But I agree...once you've used a Metcal nothing will ever be the same. Come in, turn on the Metcal, sitdown, and the iron is already waiting for you. Seriously...they heat up from room temp within 5 seconds. Amazing. I live with the Weller at home because I bought it before I ever used a Metcal. Plus I'm not producing boards anymore. With the move to large pincount SMT I've started using a toaster oven to assemble project boards. I'm thinking it might be a decent way to do a board run if I need to in the future. Hey...whatever works!!

 

[Zud]

Same here. Metcal actually recommends 600 degree tips if you are using no-clean solder, but I've yet to try a 600 degree tip. It would be nice if it worked well though, because I like no-clean solder, and 600 degrees would be easier on the boards.

What Metcal model is everyone talking about?
A link would be nice too.

 

[MaximRecoil]

What Metcal model is everyone talking about?
A link would be nice too.

I posted the following on BYOAC when I got my own Metcal a couple of years ago:

Some tips for anyone searching for Metcals on eBay or whatever:

Metcal often used different numbers for the power supply vs. the system (system includes the handpiece and workstand, along with the power supply). For example:

SP-PW1 is the model number of the power supply, while SP200 is the name of the system that is based on the SP-PW1 power supply, which includes the SP-HC1 handpiece and WS2 workstand.

RFG-30 is the name of the power supply. STSS-001 and STSS-002 are the names of the systems based on that power supply. These use the STSS-RM3E handpiece, and the later MX-RM3E handpiece is also compatible — the same applies to the PS2E-01 power supply, which came with the STSS-001/002 systems, and used the STSS-RM3E handpiece as well as the current MX-RM3E handpiece. WS1 is the current workstand that is compatible with these.

With the MX-500 they seemed to merge the model number of the power supply and the name of the system, so no confusion there. There are just different letters appended to the end of MX-500, i.e., MX-500P = power supply and MX-500S-11 = system. These also use the WS1 workstand.

The STSS and MX systems are compatible with each other, but not compatible with SP systems.

The STSS and MX systems use STTC-XXX tip cartridges. SP systems use SSC-XXXX tip cartridges.

The whole thread can be found here.

Keep in mind that the SP series is the economy line which was introduced somewhat recently, and I don't know how well they work. They are not compatible with the current and former top of the line models (STSS and MX series). At work we had both STSS and MX systems, and used them interchangeably (I could never tell the difference in soldering performance between them, though the MX systems have an extra F-type coaxial port). The Metcal I have at home is an STSS system. The MX systems are newer and more expensive on the used market (and $500+ new). Also, the new MX-5000 series is out now, which is even more expensive than the MX-500 ($675 for the basic system).

 

[jeff412]

What do you guys use for desoldering?

Jeff

 

[Fudd]

Desoldering Braid and sometimes the desoldering pump.

 

[channelmanic]

Pace soldering/desoldering unit with a built-in pump.

 

[jeff412]

Does the metcal soldering station have a desoldering wand you can swap to? Since the MX-500 has two ports, can you have a soldering iron on one and a desoldering iron on the other?

Jeff

 

[MaximRecoil]

Does the metcal soldering station have a desoldering wand you can swap to? Since the MX-500 has two ports, can you have a soldering iron on one and a desoldering iron on the other?

Yes.

At work we had the Metcal desoldering attachments for the MX-500s, but few people bothered with them. We used Edsyn Soldapullt DS017, DS017LS, and AS196 "solder suckers". Those 3 models are all the same except for their level of ESD-safeness (we used all 3 models interchangeably at work). I have a DS017LS at home.

If you get a manual "solder sucker", get the real thing, i.e., the original, fullsize Edsyn Soldapullt. The cheap knockoffs from e.g., Radio Shack or wherever, are junk.

Also, make sure you know the proper technique to using them, or it will never work right for you no matter what "solder sucker" you're using. You have to trigger the solder sucker while the solder is being kept molten by the iron. This means that the tip of the solder sucker will inevitably come into contact with the tip of your iron in the process.

A lot of people are afraid that the iron will melt the solder sucker tip if it touches it (in reality, the tips are silicone-based and quite heat resistant; plus they are replaceable), so they try to keep them from touching each other in the process, by trying to move the iron away and the solder sucker into place quickly, which results in solder that isn't fluid enough to be properly pulled away by the solder sucker. Done properly, the solder sucker will pull all but trace amounts of the solder out of e.g., through-hole joints, with one try; allowing the component you are trying to remove to simply fall out (or sometimes you may need to give each leg a slight nudge with the hot iron).

 

[demogo]

So something like this?

http://www.amazon.com/Edsyn-Deluxe-...ts=1&colid=&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending


I will have only very occasional need to desolder anything but when I do it, I'd like it to come out okay...

So should I go with this or a desoldering braid?

 

[MaximRecoil]

So something like this?

http://www.amazon.com/Edsyn-Deluxe-...ts=1&colid=&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending

Yes exactly. That is the basic DS017 model. If you want more ESD-safeness (or if you just want it in the color black, like I did), go with the DS017LS, or the AS196 if you like chrome. Those are a few dollars more though.

I will have only very occasional need to desolder anything but when I do it, I'd like it to come out okay...

So should I go with this or a desoldering braid?

They both have their place, but I use a solder sucker far more often than solder wick. For one thing, there are plenty of times when the solder sucker is the only way to go, like when desoldering through-hole joints for component removal. Also, I just prefer to use a solder sucker if at all possible; it is cleaner/neater (doesn't leave flux behind like wick does), and it is cheaper (wick is consumed as you use it, while an Edsyn will pretty much last forever). Keep a spool of wick around though for the times when you may need it.

 

[Level42]

I agree, mostly use the sucker, only once in a while the wick, but it's better at certain jobs.

 

[jeff412]

Currently I use a desoldering iron with the bulb on it. It works great. Especially for through hole parts. What makes this better? Does the Metcal desoldering iron have a vacuum pump?

Jeff

 

[cwilkson]

Currently I use a desoldering iron with the bulb on it. It works great. Especially for through hole parts. What makes this better? Does the Metcal desoldering iron have a vacuum pump?

Jeff

I've used both. I think you get higher pressure differential (= better suck) with a solder sucker. Plus, unless you get a nice one, the desoldering iron probably isn't temperature controlled. The only benefit of the desoldering iron is that it takes less physical coodination to use because it's all-in-one.

I also highly recommend the Solda-pullt for all through hole desoldering. It pulls a great vacuum, and with minimal practice, all but the ugliest joints will be completely cleaned with one try. It also doesn't clog as often as the el-cheapo Rat Shack Special. But I have to jam the Solda-pullt against the bench to cock it. Or put my soldering iron down to use the other hand. So I use the R.S.S. for most work, only because it's easier for me to use one-handed.

For surface mount touch ups I use solder braid. And if I remove a surface mount component, I always use braid to clean the pads on the board before putting the new SMT component in. I've found that I can get some extra life from the braid if I flip the excess molten solder off of it (like a wet toothbrush). It stays tinned too, so it works better the next time.

 

[jeff412]

I've used the pop suckers from Radio Shack and they are awful. That's the reason I went to the desoldering iron. I guess I'll have to order a Solda-Pullt and give a shot. I agree that I really like the one handed operation of the desoldering iron, but it takes several attempts to get the solder out with that little red bulb.

Jeff

 

[MaximRecoil]

For surface mount touch ups I use solder braid. And if I remove a surface mount component, I always use braid to clean the pads on the board before putting the new SMT component in.

That was the official procedure where I worked too, though I usually didn't bother when dealing with small SMT components with only two solder points. I would swipe the old component off the board with the iron, and use the residual solder on the pads to tack the new component in place using a pair of tweezers and the iron; then solder the other side and reflow the tacked side. The whole process took maybe 10 seconds, assuming you had the replacement component all ready to go (rather than digging through bins for it).

Have you ever replaced an SMT electrolytic capacitor like these? Those things are a bitch to remove, because the legs are pretty much inaccessible. They're no picnic to try to solder in place either.

 

[MaximRecoil]

but it takes several attempts to get the solder out with that little red bulb.

Well you have your answer on what makes the Soldapullt better, right there. When done correctly, the solder is gone on the first try. In addition to being slow, you are also abusing the pad with excessive heat by using several attempts.

Just make sure you get one of the standard fullsize Soldapullts like I listed above. Edsyn also makes compact versions but they suck (and not in a good way).

Sometimes new hires would solder an entire board with the wrong terminal blocks, and I (or someone else on my line) would have to remove them. That was about 400 through-hole joints. I could do it in less than 10 minutes with the Soldapullt (yes, I used the "jam the Solda-pullt against the bench" cocking method as mentioned by Cwilkson).

 

[demogo]

Cool, I'll order the Edsyn unit that I linked in above...

Just heat until the solder is liquid and then suck it off with this thing? Does that about cover it?

Just out of curiosity, where does this thing suck it to? You have to be able to discard it somehow...

 

[MaximRecoil]

Cool, I'll order the Edsyn unit that I linked in above...

Just heat until the solder is liquid and then suck it off with this thing? Does that about cover it?

Using a typical through-hole joint as an example; press the hot iron onto the joint (against the pad and post) as if you were going to reflow it, and then while keeping the iron there to keep the solder molten, press the tip of the solder sucker down over the post and onto the pad, and press the trigger. As I mentioned earlier, your solder sucker tip will make contact with the iron (more or less depending on the size and shape of the iron tip), but don't worry about that.

Like this:

Just out of curiosity, where does this thing suck it to? You have to be able to discard it somehow...

The solder goes into the barrel of the solder sucker. You twist and pull to take the solder sucker apart, and just tap the barrel and the dried solder will fall out. If the tip is clogged, you will see a metal rod that is part of the plunger assembly in the top half of the unit when you take it apart; push that rod through the outside opening of the tip to dislodge any solder that may be in there. The tip is pretty good at self cleaning though, because everytime you cock the solder sucker, that metal rod pushes through the tip which helps keep it cleaned out.

 

[jeff412]

Ok. I'm conviced. I am going to try to find a reasonably priced Metcal soldering station. Now, what tips do I need? I see that you recommend the 126. Do you use that for everything or do you use different tips for different applications?

Jeff