Slingshot switches on F-14 Tomcat not working

jehuie

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I'm editing this first post to better explain along with pics...

This is one of the slingshots I'm having problems with. I'm pointing to the two switches for it.

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And here are the two sets of wires that I believe those switches should connect to. Notice that one bunch is greens and the other is whites.

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And this is under the playfield, same switches. Instead of the expected green wire, I've got this orange wire with brown and what that appears to be completely white.

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But the only orange/brown wires I see on the mpu board are up here and have nothing to do with that switch, at least I think:

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So I'm confused. My guess is that I'm missing something incredibly basic here.
 

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Crickets chirping. Ok let me try this one:

The colors listed along the columns in the switch matrix chart show the wires as all Green with various color stripes. The ones listed for the rows are all white with various stripes.

When I look at the connectors on the mpu board they match up with that exactly. However, when I look at the switches on the slingshots there are no green wires at all. Only orange with brown. There is a white wire attached to each...it's hard to tell the stripe colors for sure.

But why...oh why....aren't there any green wires connected to either of these switches?
 
Have you checked continuity of wiring from the slingshot points to the connector on the mpu ?

You likely have a break along the way that you need to find and fix.

LTG :)
 
Have you checked continuity of wiring from the slingshot points to the connector on the mpu ?

You likely have a break along the way that you need to find and fix.

LTG :)

Well that's what's confusing...the colors don't match on the wires between the two. At all.

There's an orange/brown wire on the switch but it looks like it should be green. I'll take some pics.
 
Ok...I went back and edited the first post in this thread and explained it better and added pics. Please scroll up if you haven't seen the pics already. Thanks guys!
 
wiring on the coils appears to me to be correct,


here is what i think


you have a bad transistor (pre driver or driver) on the system 11 mpu, without looking its probably either a tip 122/tip102 or tip 42 or both

you need to download the manual pdf

it will tell you which connector and row the switch is on, test those transistors with a dmm set to diode function they should read between .4 and .7, if any read less.....replace it
 
As dc2010 said you need to download the coil and switch matrix. From what you have said we don't know if there is a switch problem or coil problem.

By using the test function of your pin you can find out if it is a switch problem by looking at the switch matrix. If all switches in the row and column of the switch work then it's not the switch probably.

Use the same method with the coil matrix and you will find you faulty component(s)
 
Well I thought I had tested the coil earlier but when I just did it's not working. Neither the switch or the coil will do anything in the diagnostic tests. For either of the slingshots or the pop bumper. Hmmmm. I do have the manual. I did the "quick and dirty test" on all those transistors before but let me run through them one more time just to be sure. Thanks guys.

Incidentally, my question about wiring wasn't wiring to the coil. But to the switch. I'm still confused why there's a orange wire going to the switch.
 
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wiring on the coils appears to me to be correct,


here is what i think


you have a bad transistor (pre driver or driver) on the system 11 mpu, without looking its probably either a tip 122/tip102 or tip 42 or both

you need to download the manual pdf

it will tell you which connector and row the switch is on, test those transistors with a dmm set to diode function they should read between .4 and .7, if any read less.....replace it


Should this be the reading on all that large transistors on the board or just the ones one the lower left? The ones down there all read within that range except Q17 which is low....3ish. I think I have a spare one. Is the tiny transistor next to it the pre-driver? Should I go ahead and replace both just in case?

And this would only account for one of the three non-working coils right?

I also checked the other transistors to the right and the ones up in the top right and they were all completely outside that range. And I had to reverse the leads on my meter to get a reading.
 
polarity on them is important, a pnp= positive neg positive, so your positive lead would go on the middle(neg) lug and your neg lead would go on either side

and npn is just the opposite


the smaller transistor(tip 122 or 102) is the pre-driver

larger main driver is i believe a tip 42 on sys 11, all transistors should read .4 to .7, unless there are other components driving it down(resistors in peticular)iirc ive only encountered this on gottlieb system 3 driver boards

q17 needs to be replaced and could be the culprit but im not looking in the manual, what does the manual say it controls?

the wiring on the coils is important because the switch is connected to them...
 
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Should this be the reading on all that large transistors on the board or just the ones one the lower left? The ones down there all read within that range except Q17 which is low....3ish. I think I have a spare one. Is the tiny transistor next to it the pre-driver? Should I go ahead and replace both just in case?

And this would only account for one of the three non-working coils right?

I also checked the other transistors to the right and the ones up in the top right and they were all completely outside that range. And I had to reverse the leads on my meter to get a reading.

Wow.. So you're saying the drive and pre-drive transistors were all blown? Me thinks something was connected wrong or a serious switch matrix issue...
 
Wow.. So you're saying the drive and pre-drive transistors were all blown? Me thinks something was connected wrong or a serious switch matrix issue...

im thinking he was trying to test without regard to polarity, but there have been occasions where ive seen transistors(in rows) all read in between .3 an.4 because there is a row of resistors connected , but HE needs to look up the SPECIFIC transistors that control thos slings etc...and replace transistors related
 
Wow.. So you're saying the drive and pre-drive transistors were all blown? Me thinks something was connected wrong or a serious switch matrix issue...

No no....the ones on the top just had a much higher reading than the ones on the bottom but they are clearly working since most other stuff is operating fine.

I'll dig through the manual later and see which transistors control what. Thanks again guys for leading me in the right direction. Appreciate it!
 
im sure its nothing to be embarrassed about. i had my royal rumble on when adjusting a leaf switch and fried a column transistor. a total noob mistake. the good part is i learned more about pin repair and pindork1 was kind enough to fix it for me and teach me a whole bunch about how the boards work.im glad you got it working. be sure to post pics before and after cleaning.
 
im sure its nothing to be embarrassed about. i had my royal rumble on when adjusting a leaf switch and fried a column transistor. a total noob mistake. the good part is i learned more about pin repair and pindork1 was kind enough to fix it for me and teach me a whole bunch about how the boards work.im glad you got it working. be sure to post pics before and after cleaning.

Thanks I'll be sure to do that. I'm considering removing the overlay from the playfield first. But a bit nervous about it.
 
Thanks I'll be sure to do that. I'm considering removing the overlay from the playfield first. But a bit nervous about it.

I have the same overlay on my F-14 playfield too. I always thought it was an aftermarket addition. I wonder if it was done at factory?
 
Fixed it. But not telling you what I did because I'm hanging my head in shame.

No shame here, we've all done silly things. If you let everyone know then maybe someone else can avoid the problem.

Good to see it's working now. - Barry
 
Thanks I'll be sure to do that. I'm considering removing the overlay from the playfield first. But a bit nervous about it.

I was too. I removed 2 large pieces from my Revenge From Mars and I'm happy I did. I just used the freeze spray method and went slow. It worked like a charm. After cleaning/polishing/waxing I put 2 1" diameter mylar dots where the ball falls through the ramp on to the playfiled to avoid a damaging that area.

How far are you going with your machine teardown/clean/polish wise?

-Barry
 
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