Sinbad SS System 1 Help

who922

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I am having problems with my Sinbad Pin. I am not a pinball repair whiz by any means. I do know how to repair things because I am a computer tech. A couple of things I would like some input on...and if possible, it would help me if you could answer with my limited knowledge in mind. And, yes, I have thought of having someone else llok at it, but the closest is 3 hours from me, so you see the logistical problem.

I have read about a ground repair for System 1 machines that really helps. Can someone tell me how to do this or point me in the right direction?

In 3 of the 4 banks of targets their are one or two targets that don't work. Therefore, I can only get double bonus and nothing more. It wasn't working when I bought it. When I got it home, the machine worked perfectly for that evening. The next day it didn't and hasn't since. Any ideas?

Finally, the right flipper is stuck in the up position once it is used. When you turn it off it goes back down until you turn it on and use it again and it sticks.

Thanks for the help. I really want to get it working well before I start other restorations.
 
Yeah, I've been there. In fact I already had that tab open. The honest answer is that I'm just not understanding. And, I haven't found the ground repair solution there.
 
Yeah, the system 1 guide is awesome. Too bad many of the troubleshooting processes work like a choose your own adventure book.

Do this, do that, do that... oh sorry! You're switch matrix Spider chip has a short.

Having several targets out sounds like a switch matrix issue. If you refer to the switch matrix diagram in the manual, you will be able to determine if all the dead switches are on the same row or column.

The ground repair thing is in the "Before you turn the game on" section. It tells you exactly where to solder on a ground wire for each board.

Bottom line is you pretty much have to read that guide several times, then go back and read specific sections while tinkering with the actual machine to understand it.
 
Well it sounds like the machine DID work, so I would think you MIGHT have a intermittent problem. First thing I would check would be the connectors. The ones you want to check is J6 J7 on the CPU PCB. Try cleaning the contacts on both the circuit boards, and the connector pins. Best option would be to replace the pins, but you can try cleaning them. You might also want to try cleaning the switch themselves.
Good Luck with it....Sinbad is a cool machine. I just picked one up for my wife! Certainly not the easiest and reliable system to fix, but a fun machine!
-Mark
 
Also forgot to add, that the switch matrix connectors, (J6 and J7) are often damaged, because of acid damage. The battery is soldered just above these connectors....and if it is still there remove it!
-Mark
 
I checked a couple of things last night. When the flipper is stuck in the up position, I couldn't even force it back down. As usual, when I turned it off it went down immediately. I checked for any place that something might be touching, but no go. This thought just occurred to me. Since it is a double flipper and both of them stick in the up position, would that change the diagnosis?

Also, the old battery is still there. I didn't see any obvious leakage, but possibly there is behind it. After looking at the repair guide again it looks like I am going to need to learn to solder quickly and I will need a pinball/electronics lexicon nearby to understand the terms!
 
Another question too, (yes I have a lot) There is a sign inside the machine near the boards that says "when removing circuit boards turn the unit off at the switch and leave the unit plugged in" Is that what I need to do when I start taking these things off to work on them?
 
I typically leave the machine plugged in and turned off, but I would imagine that they recommend you do that to keep the PCB's grounded. (provided the 3 prong plug is present)
As far as the flippers acting up, there is not much going on with them, they have a relay that allows them to turn on and off, when the machine has a game started. Check the wiring on the flippers, and the EOS switch.
-Mark
 
I am having problems with my Sinbad Pin.

...

It wasn't working when I bought it. When I got it home, the machine worked perfectly for that evening. The next day it didn't and hasn't since. Any ideas?


Connectors, connectors, connectors.
Gottlieb edge connectors are notorious for causing problems such as this.
Repin the connectors then get back with us.

Ed
 
You probably have a stuck switch on your flipper assemblies.

You will get absolutely nowhere with the rest of your issues until you completely go through the "Before you turn the game on" mods and connector re-pinning. Those are mandatory.
 
Good call Shardian, I took it apart this afternoon and the contact on the flipper button was actually sticking together. It looks like the round piece is gone from one side. I did get it to work though.

So, I went through the manual and looked at the schematics. All of the things that are not working are on A1-J7-3. I looked at the A1J73 on the CPU board and the pin looked good, the solder looked good and I tried to clean it to see if that would help. I put it back together and it's a no go.

I guess I will have to go through the "before you begin" section and try to figure out what I'm doing.
 
Hello,

Could you explain this a little more: "In 3 of the 4 banks of targets there are one or two targets that don't work. Therefore, I can only get double bonus and nothing more" Do you mean the drop targets don't fall, or they don't score when they fall? What drop targets are not working? The single white one on the left? The two yellow ones in the middle? The three purple ones on the right? The red ones in the back? Knowing the ones that are not working correctly could help, the yellow, purple and red banks have an extra set of points (switch) that closes when all the drop targets of that color fall it triggers the bonus for that set of drop targets. Are the bonuses working correctly?
 
I will be watching this thread, I have a beautiful dead Sinbad in my garage next in line...please keep us posted :)
 
Ok, so the answer is that all of the drop targets fall. They just don't score and since they don't score it doesn't know they have fallen and thus the bonus does not increase nor do the targets reset once I knock them all down. So, it is one yellow, one purple, two red, the 2nd and 4th top rollovers and the bottom round target.

Like I said in my earlier post I did figure out by looking at the schematics in the manual that all of these are connected to the A1 J7 3 plug. I was hoping that info would help.

I'm going to get the AV guy here at work to help me do the ground and battery procedures, but I don't know that it will help this problem.
 
I would really double check that connector. If you are sure that you have a good connection, and that your wiring is good, then you might have a bad chip at Z8 or Z9.
-Mark
 
Did you check the switches that register a hit on the targets?

I second that

The leaf switches on that particular game to register the drop target actually dropping are gold plated. You can only clean them a few ways. Most people clean them with a file which renders the switch useless.

Case in point. On my Sinbad, one of the rollovers was not always registering when playing a game. When you did a switch test it always passed. I replaced the actual leaf switch itself and the problem was corrected. Further inspection of the leaf switch revealed that the contacts were compromised. They would check with continuity with a meter, but when you tried to pass large amounts of current through it, it would fail. When you looked at the contacts magnified they were heavily pitted and looked like crap...
 
Ok, so the answer is that all of the drop targets fall. They just don't score and since they don't score it doesn't know they have fallen and thus the bonus does not increase nor do the targets reset once I knock them all down. So, it is one yellow, one purple, two red, the 2nd and 4th top rollovers and the bottom round target.

Like I said in my earlier post I did figure out by looking at the schematics in the manual that all of these are connected to the A1 J7 3 plug. I was hoping that info would help.

I'm going to get the AV guy here at work to help me do the ground and battery procedures, but I don't know that it will help this problem.

I am looking at the Gottlieb C-18037 switch matrix and I see what you are talking about. The upper round target should be affected also. If the A1J7-3 pin is making a good connection I would check the the diodes to see if any are bad. Take a good look at the switches also and run some type of cleaning paper (like a clean strip of a business card) across them. Look at the wireing around the switches also and make sure nothings touching a ground or something like that. Really test the continuity of that A1J7-3 pin, I have heard the wire corrodes internally sometimes and it looks good but does not work.
 
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