Sellers thoughts on declaring lower value on Intl packages?

darinjacobs

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Sellers thoughts on declaring lower value on Intl packages?

Once in awhile I get a customer who asks me to put a specific value on a package that is far lower than the selling price. I know they are trying to save on import fees/taxes.

I have only done this on a few occassions and to only existing customers. I know this brings up ethical and legal issues. Im signing a customs form swearing under oath that the value is genuine. If I do this I can only insure it for the declared value. So if there is an issue with damage or the package goes missing we are in a sticky situation as sellers. Even if the buyer has told us in writing to lower the value and we have proof of it they will win a paypal dispute according to my paypal rep.

Case in point I have a potential newbie customer from Italy who is all bent out of shape that I wont declare his ArcadeSD for $20! Ya dont think that would go bad for me if it got damaged or lost? Then he throws some 9/11 comments out there that I took great offense to even though he later claimed it wasnt meant as such. Yeah right. I wont do things the way you want and you throw 9/11 comments at me and Im supposed to take them as harmless?

What do you sellers normally do when they ask for a declared value lower than the selling price? btw, Ive been selling art since 2000 and never had someone get pissy with me over not wanting to do it.
 
I refuse to do it. I am sure I don't sell anywhere near the volume of stuff that you do, but this is just too insignificant of a thing to lie about. If you can't afford purchase price, shipping, and taxes then you shouldn't be buying the item.


By the way, I also don't pay for Paypal items via the 'gift' option. I calculate the additional costs and pay them upfront with my purchase. I really don't understand why people think they should be allowed to use Paypal without paying for it. Again, if the Paypal fees are too high then don't use Paypal.
 
If you're shipping to canada with USPS it doesn't reallt matter what you declare since they rarely charge taxes/duties. However if you ship to Canada and use UPS we get hit hard. Most cases we pay more than what the item is worth just to accept the package.
 
If you're shipping to canada with USPS it doesn't reallt matter what you declare since they rarely charge taxes/duties. However if you ship to Canada and use UPS we get hit hard. Most cases we pay more than what the item is worth just to accept the package.

So true. I work for a major courier company, not UPS, and I will 100% not buy anything if they ship via UPS. A co-worker bought some sort of kids toy for his son valued at $40.00 from the USA. UPS put a $60.00 brokerage fee plus taxes. If I can't get it via USPS or Fedex, I won't buy it. If I sell something, it goes Fedex. As far as value,,if customs don't believe you, they will put there own value on it.
 
So true. I work for a major courier company, not UPS, and I will 100% not buy anything if they ship via UPS. A co-worker bought some sort of kids toy for his son valued at $40.00 from the USA. UPS put a $60.00 brokerage fee plus taxes. If I can't get it via USPS or Fedex, I won't buy it. If I sell something, it goes Fedex. As far as value,,if customs don't believe you, they will put there own value on it.


If I get a request to not ship with a certain company I'll certainly do so. Normally for domestic and international packages I try and stick with USPS. My back-up is UPS, but only if I just can't get to the post office before they close. I do not have a convenient FedEx location so that is not normally an option since they can not pick-up at my office (they have limited access to the military base) and I can't be home mid day for pick-up either.
 
Unless you are making $250 profit per board, it is NOT worth it. I stopped selling on eBay 5 or so years ago and that was just one of many reasons I chose not to deal with international sales. Yeah, I took lower prices for my stuff by not opening it up to foreign bidders, but when you have a "locked" commodity item like yours (meaning that it's not a single rare item -- you have tons of stock; and it is sold at a consistent price--not that it's available from tons of random suppliers at the same price) if the buyer really wants it, they will find a way to buy it--and you will still benefit. Either they suck it up and pay the duties or find a US buyer to buy it and forward it to him with the lower declared value.

So, not even speaking of the legal/moral reasons, it simply is not worth it to play their games. Throw in legal reasons and you have more (monetary) reasons not to--like a huge government fine.

If you do cave, you're one step closer to the overseas pirates that killed the first incarnation of this anyway.. they're well known for "gift $5" markings.
 
I shipped stuff over to England recently and was told by the Post Office Worker to mark it as a gift, he said often times they don't charge any additional fees. I also didn't insure the package and he suggested since I wasn't insuring it to mark a fairly low value.

He stated England has a few packages "go missing" if they think there are electronics like iPod for example, and since my box was marked fragile electronics, he said mark a low value so they don't think it is something good.

Thought that was quite strange.

In the end the buyer still had to pay a fee to pick up his package anyways.

I would ere on the side of honesty. And in your case it makes sense across the board. I only de-valued the items value for me out of concern for theft.
 
Maybe tell him you'll do it but you won't honor any guarantees or refunds on the product. He should respect your terms if he's the one asking you to bend the rules.

Case in point I have a potential newbie customer from Italy who is all bent out of shape that I wont declare his ArcadeSD for $20! Ya dont think that would go bad for me if it got damaged or lost? Then he throws some 9/11 comments out there that I took great offense to even though he later claimed it wasnt meant as such. Yeah right. I wont do things the way you want and you throw 9/11 comments at me and Im supposed to take them as harmless?

What do you sellers normally do when they ask for a declared value lower than the selling price? btw, Ive been selling art since 2000 and never had someone get pissy with me over not wanting to do it.
 
only if they paypal as a gift so they are shit out of luck if they want a refund. personally i dont ship anything to italy, got burned too many times and there is no delivery confirmation.
 
only if they paypal as a gift so they are shit out of luck if they want a refund. personally i dont ship anything to italy, got burned too many times and there is no delivery confirmation.

Oh, Italy, I need to skim better.

Don't do it. Italy is the worst in Europe to ship to. I will never ship to Italy. The UK I will now, France no problem, Spain ehhhhh, Italy No EFFING WAY!

If he wants it then he has to pay for it, and pay right for it.
 
Maybe tell him you'll do it but you won't honor any guarantees or refunds on the product. He should respect your terms if he's the one asking you to bend the rules.

Won't work -- PayPal will side to the (scamming) buyer 100% of the time. In that case Darren will be out the board AND the money and the buyer will probably have a good board anyway and get more than what he wanted. It's not worth it when PayPal is in the middle.

Stick to your guns and protect yourself.
 
I've mailed stuff to Canada and labeled it as a "gift" in order to save them on shipping duties.

And I've had 60-in-1 packages come in from Hong Kong with each item listed as $5....
 
Once in awhile I get a customer who asks me to put a specific value on a package that is far lower than the selling price. I know they are trying to save on import fees/taxes.

I have only done this on a few occassions and to only existing customers. I know this brings up ethical and legal issues. Im signing a customs form swearing under oath that the value is genuine. If I do this I can only insure it for the declared value. So if there is an issue with damage or the package goes missing we are in a sticky situation as sellers. Even if the buyer has told us in writing to lower the value and we have proof of it they will win a paypal dispute according to my paypal rep.

Case in point I have a potential newbie customer from Italy who is all bent out of shape that I wont declare his ArcadeSD for $20! Ya dont think that would go bad for me if it got damaged or lost? Then he throws some 9/11 comments out there that I took great offense to even though he later claimed it wasnt meant as such. Yeah right. I wont do things the way you want and you throw 9/11 comments at me and Im supposed to take them as harmless?

What do you sellers normally do when they ask for a declared value lower than the selling price? btw, Ive been selling art since 2000 and never had someone get pissy with me over not wanting to do it.

Absolutely not. NEVER declare for a lower value than the real price. When I do EBay auctions that are accessible to international buyers, I put a statement in the auction that I won't lie on customs forms. That kind of hassle I DO NOT need.

It's REALLY not worth your trouble to commit customs fraud just so some guy can save a few bucks. If it was you saving the money, then perhaps you might be willing to risk it, but why should you take the risks just so someone else can save a few bucks?
 
I've noticed a number of sellers on ebay who won't ship to Italy. Often, it's the only country that they won't ship to (or one of a very small number).
 
I've noticed a number of sellers on ebay who won't ship to Italy. Often, it's the only country that they won't ship to (or one of a very small number).

I've been told that the Italian postal service is quite riddled with thieves and that many packages go missing (or their contents do). Apparently, when in Rome it's common to walk whatever extra distance you need to and use the Vatican City post office instead of the Italian ones - the Vatican's mail apparently does not have these problems...
 
If the requested value is close to the actual value I will do it(actual $80, requested $50.00). In this case if the guy gave you attitude and disrespect, tell him to take a hike. I am sure if the guy was nice about the whole process, over time you could have built a good rapport with him and eventually he might have gotten what he had wanted.
 
I refuse to do it. I am sure I don't sell anywhere near the volume of stuff that you do, but this is just too insignificant of a thing to lie about. If you can't afford purchase price, shipping, and taxes then you shouldn't be buying the item.


By the way, I also don't pay for Paypal items via the 'gift' option. I calculate the additional costs and pay them upfront with my purchase. I really don't understand why people think they should be allowed to use Paypal without paying for it. Again, if the Paypal fees are too high then don't use Paypal.

Depends on the item and how well I know the person. If paypal is allowing P2P gifts of cash, then functionally, it's no different to me because I'm NOT getting any kind of guarantee for the purchase anyways. All they're doing is facilitating a wire transfer without me having to give someone an account number.

That said, if I'm actually using CREDIT to transfer money via PayPal (Only done this twice ever.), or to pay money to someone I don't necessarily trust, or it's more than 50-ish bucks...I generally will just go ahead and pay the fee so that I get some protection.
 
The guy sounds like nothing but problems. Anyone that is going to be ugly from the start and even think to make bad remarks in regards to 9-11 is someone I would not think twice about refusing service to. Say you went ahead with the transaction, I bet it wouldn't be the last you heard from him. Probably justthe start of a nightmare. I say move along.
 
Don't do it. The risk is way, way, way more than the benefit. I will only ship to Europe if I have a rapport built up with the person I am shipping to. And I will not misdeclare the value. If you declare the value as $50 you can only insure it for $50, so when it goes missing (about 50% of the time in Italy), the most you can get back from the insurance is $50. Period. So you are out a $300 board + $20 shipping and you can only recover $50 and 9/10ths of the time the a-hole tells you to cancel the order (because he now has a "free" board) and you are out the $320 you charged him. Save yourself the hassle and either refund his money now, or tell him you can't ship to Europe, but if he has someone in the US he trusts, you can ship to a US address and his friend can reship it to him.

I do this all the time on Ebay. I won't ship to any country other than Canada, so I tell the people that want me to ship internationally that I will ship to a friend in the US who can get it to the buyer. Scammers will usually bail and serious buyers usually have someone to reship for them.

ken
 
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