Sellers: Do you mark boards?

joemagiera

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A buddy of mine was relating some KLOV/EBAY/RGVAC selling experiences. He said that he sold a board as tested working, and the buyer returned it because when he got it, claimed it wasn't working. My buddy gave a refund. But when he examined the returned board, he was fairly sure it wasn't the same board that he sold.

So he started discretely "marking" any PCB he sold as tested working. Sure enough, he got another return, from a different person and they returned a different board. Of course they pleaded honest mistake and they got their boards mixed up in testing.

We've all heard stories of buying boards that were supposed to be tested working and they weren't (to the extent that they were even missing needed chips), but I guess I'm naive, I never considered the opposite direction. I didn't expect people to claim a board wasn't working and return a known dead one trying to pass it off as the one that was sold.

So how many of you sellers secretly mark your boards? What's been your experience on returns of a different board? As easy as it is for a buyer to make a paypal claim now days, I guess I need to start doing that myself.
 
I think you'd be crazy not to, though I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make if someone filed a paypal claim against you.
 
Depends on who I sell it to. If it's Phet, then it has a tiny rainbow somewhere. Frizz gets the number of the local DEA office. Sav gets a "Padres Suck!". Jow gets a price tag (since he's gonna sell it in two weeks anyway). Etc. Etc.




(Too bad I've never sold a board to these gentleman...)
 
If I repair it then sell it, I have a log of it. Otherwise, I may mark it if it's going to someone I've never sold to before just for protection.

I've never had that problem before where the marks came in handy. It's a "just in case" thing that I've never needed.

I did do a repair on a rare board once that the guy accused me of swapping chips on. Now THAT pissed me off. It even shipped back with the same mask ROMs it came with!
 
trick ink

you must use a special ink that is visible under a ultra violet light.

the switch swap game is bullshit, and is becoming a very big problem for sellers.
 
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Many boards have serial numbers on them already that I log. If not, a permanent marker id in a discrete spot or even better a close up picture of the board as the chip date codes and manufacturers in combination will be unique. I got burned once by a guy who claimed the board was damaged in shipment - I always insure them and pack them well. The board came back missing the parts he needed and obviously took. What a schmuck.

Bill
 
Mikes Arcade puts one of those plastic locking tags like they put on utility access boxes. Says Mikes Arcade and has a serial number.
 
Many boards have serial numbers on them already that I log. If not, a permanent marker id in a discrete spot or even better a close up picture of the board as the chip date codes and manufacturers in combination will be unique.

Yeah, there's almost always some subtle differences between all boards. So if it's going to someone I don't know I just make sure I snap a good clear picture of it before it goes out. If it's a high-end board then I might consider the UV ink trick. I don't like when sellers write all over the board with permanent marker... one of the first things I do when I get a board like that is clean that crap off with goo-gone and alcohol.
 
A buddy of mine was relating some KLOV/EBAY/RGVAC selling experiences. He said that he sold a board as tested working, and the buyer returned it because when he got it, claimed it wasn't working. My buddy gave a refund. But when he examined the returned board, he was fairly sure it wasn't the same board that he sold.

So he started discretely "marking" any PCB he sold as tested working. Sure enough, he got another return, from a different person and they returned a different board. Of course they pleaded honest mistake and they got their boards mixed up in testing.

We've all heard stories of buying boards that were supposed to be tested working and they weren't (to the extent that they were even missing needed chips), but I guess I'm naive, I never considered the opposite direction. I didn't expect people to claim a board wasn't working and return a known dead one trying to pass it off as the one that was sold.

So how many of you sellers secretly mark your boards? What's been your experience on returns of a different board? As easy as it is for a buyer to make a paypal claim now days, I guess I need to start doing that myself.


I sell all my boards tested working but AS-IS. The reason for this is that there really is no reason to warranty a 30 year old circuit board. Even if it has been repaired, its just as likely to fail in service as any other pcb. Also the fact that I can't check out the customers cabinet to make sure he has no power supply issues or even knows how to install it correctly. This may make it a little harder to sell, but I don't want the 'walmart' customer that thinks he owns me because he gave me 100 dollars for a pcb. It's easier for me to do this since I have been buying and selling for 10 years now. Most people have heard of me so my reputation helps off set this a bit.
 
I sell all my boards tested working but AS-IS. The reason for this is that there really is no reason to warranty a 30 year old circuit board. Even if it has been repaired, its just as likely to fail in service as any other pcb. Also the fact that I can't check out the customers cabinet to make sure he has no power supply issues or even knows how to install it correctly. This may make it a little harder to sell, but I don't want the 'walmart' customer that thinks he owns me because he gave me 100 dollars for a pcb. It's easier for me to do this since I have been buying and selling for 10 years now. Most people have heard of me so my reputation helps off set this a bit.

That's the only sensible thing to do - you can't give a warranty on a 30 year old PCB, it just doesn't make sense.
 
I have several markings on my boards but alot of them are for identification reasons for myself to indicate status of the board while on my shelves. I try to keep all my working/non working boards on seperate shelves but you know how that goes. Even though they are marked as working I always retest directly prior to packaging them up.
Never had someone claim a board was not working and sent a different one back. Even without markings I would know my work if it was a board I repaired. Since 99 percent of the boards I get are non working nearly everything I sell I would have done some work on.
 
I had a Sanyo EVZ I repaired. The guy called me several months later and said he just pulled it off his shelf to use...and it didn't work. I told him to send it back. When I got it back....someone had done one of Bob Roberts video inversions kits on it (this inversion kit was NOT on it when I repaired it). Hell, I don't even know if this was the same chassis. I "re-fixed" it. When he picked it back up....I asked who else had been messing with it. He said no one....it had just been setting on his shelf waiting for use. I nicely called him a liar, pointed out the freshly installed inversion kit, and proceeded to rip him a new ass. God, I love owning my own business!

Edward
 
You are openly welcoming problems if you send ANYTHING without an identification mark of some sort. I learned a very hard lesson running my own business buying laptop parts from Gateway liquidation. I had a customer (that I trusted) call me asking for LCD's and I had a pile of them, was too busy to test them and I told him I've had a great success rate and would send him the stack and he can let me know if any are bad. These screens ran ~$125 a piece at the time. He reported back that 2 out of 8 were good. Well trusting the guy I said just pitch the bad ones don;t worry about sending them back. Later on I found out the guy was infamous for pulling this crap ... which reminded me of a few instances of sending him laptop chassis he claimed was bad. People that pull this crap are worthless.
 
Boards

I mark them if I do not know the buyer. Discrete numbers that look like factory numbers usually. Atari's are easy since they have marker on them allready most the time.
 
There is no need to mark a board. Simply take a high res picture of the board so that you can read the details on EVERY chip. Make sure this picture is included with the sale / auction post.

There is 0 chance of you receiving a different board back that will have the exact same date codes on every single chip on a board, let alone same manufacturers for that matter for any 74LS* chips and most others.
 
I think you'd be crazy not to, though I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make if someone filed a paypal claim against you.

This is the key right here. I highly doubt paypal is going to care if you wrote UV numbers on the board somewhere. I think if someone does a Paypal claim on a switch like this, you are still going to be screwed. Best case scenario would be that your money is tied for months while they "investigate" and that you get it back eventually.
 
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths some of these sleazy bastards will go to to get a (relatively) inexpensive item for free. *shakes head* :(
 
I have been tracking the serial numbers and take pictures before I ship. I also agree with the gentlemen that don't give warranties on 30 year old boards. If I sell on Ebay, I give as good a description as I can. I disclose any issues even if they will affect the selling price. I also place in the descriptions that these are AS-IS and no returns.

Do I stand behind the boards I repair? Hell yeah! But since I am not there, I can't tell if you are plugging it into 5V or 50V, so I will work with you if it doesn't work right, but I don't want it back. That's why I sold it.

ken
 
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