Rockola 490... skipping?

darthphunk

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Hey guys. My Rockola 490 seems to skip on most records I play. There are a couple of older records that skip in the very same spot, but most on other songs are pretty random.

First... I do need to clean the records that are in there. It's not particularly dusty, but it does look like it needs some attention.

Second... I know I can adjust the tone arm, but what is the proper pressure setting? The manual says it can go from 3 to 5 grams (haven't checked what its set at currently) but is more pressure better? Less?

Read on another forum that taping a penny or nickel to the tone arm can help if the adjustment doesn't. Sounds a little much though.

Any advice?

Thanks!
 
IIRC, there is an adjustment under the tone arm. Moving it one way adds more weight to the needle, and the other way takes weight off. It sounds like you need top adjust it so it adds some weight to the tone arm. You just need to add a little pressure to the tone arm until it doesn't skip so much.

I had a 454 and it took a little patience until I got the right spot. Keep in mind that the quality of records can also cause skipping. Make sure the records are clean. I don't mean just wipe them down, but use a Discwasher to clean out the grooves. I had some 45s that skipped at first, but after a good cleaning with a Discwasher, they didn't skip anymore.

Another factor is the needle. Is it an older needle, or did you replace it with a new one? When I had my 454, the needle that was in it was horrible. I bought a bunch of new, diamond needles off of eBay when they were like $10 each and it worked like a gem. Better quality sound and not as picky about the records.

Just a couple tips that worked for me...

Bill
 
IIRC, there is an adjustment under the tone arm. Moving it one way adds more weight to the needle, and the other way takes weight off. It sounds like you need top adjust it so it adds some weight to the tone arm. You just need to add a little pressure to the tone arm until it doesn't skip so much.

I had a 454 and it took a little patience until I got the right spot. Keep in mind that the quality of records can also cause skipping. Make sure the records are clean. I don't mean just wipe them down, but use a Discwasher to clean out the grooves. I had some 45s that skipped at first, but after a good cleaning with a Discwasher, they didn't skip anymore.

Another factor is the needle. Is it an older needle, or did you replace it with a new one? When I had my 454, the needle that was in it was horrible. I bought a bunch of new, diamond needles off of eBay when they were like $10 each and it worked like a gem. Better quality sound and not as picky about the records.

Just a couple tips that worked for me...

Bill

Thanks for the advice!

Are all needles the same sizewise? Or is there a vertain type I should look at for my 490?
 
And check what kind of cartridge you have. The needle matches the cartridge, not the juke, and the cartridge may have been changed at some point.

It's hard to set tracking force properly without a force gauge, but you can guess by looking at the amount the needle deflects when the tone arm is resting on a record. You want it to deflect a little - not so much that the cartridge almost drags on the record, but not so little that the needle doesn't deflect at all. Somewhere in the middle is good. In general, too heavy is better than too light. A low tracking force causes the needle to bounce around in the groove, leading to groove wall damage and wear you records out very quickly. It'll also skip a lot.

If you look on the Internet for information on cleaning records, prepare to be amazed. Audio guys are worse than arcade restoration perfectionists. In general, a discwasher brush is fine, you can also use distilled water with a drop of Dawn dish detergent added and a soft cloth.

-Ian
 
Needle sizes are NOT all the same. Usually their number is a clue to the actual size of the diamond used, I think the most common one for stereo records is D7. (translated to .7 mm)

Rockola's typically come equipped with a Shure M44 cart, much the same as the Rowe/AMI R series. The Shure cart/needle typically require 4-5 grams of tracking force. Of course this can very depending on the type of record you are playing too. Thicker records can actually alter your settings slightly so choose one that is the most typical of what you will be playing in your juke. I fine tune mine by ear as the finished 'measured setting' tends to be a little bass heavy for me. You can easily drive yourself crazy trying to find the perfect setting.

A guy named 'Needle Daddy' on eBay has always treated me very well. Has lots of oddball ones you can't get anywhere else and gives bulk discounts.
 
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I've seen many skipping problems on Rock-ola's due to using the cheap imported clone needles. Use only the genuine SHURE needles for the M44 cartridges. There IS a difference.
 
Ken's right. I'd also recomend that you get a good diamond needle.
Them cheap ones can trash your records when they wear out.
With the records inside your machine you won't see the effects until it's too late.
 
Got a new needle. Seems to be skipping way less. New problem though, when the needle drops to start playing, it slides in and starts playing a couple seconds in to the record.

The arm is coming down in the right spot... it just can't "grab" right away.

Weird.

I need to check the tension on the arm yet... I also need to clean the records. Haven't had time since I have been building my bar.

I'll keep you posted when I get back to it. I really appreciate all of the help and advice.

Thanks!
 
Got a new needle. Seems to be skipping way less. New problem though, when the needle drops to start playing, it slides in and starts playing a couple seconds in to the record.

The arm is coming down in the right spot... it just can't "grab" right away.

Do you mean that the needle is contacting the record and starts following the groove a while before you get any sound? There is a muting circuit in jukes to prevent changer motor noise from getting into the audio, and to keep that *thump* of the needle hitting the record from being audible. Perhaps whatever triggers that is slow?

-Ian
 
The wire running from the tonearm down to the amp may be hardened from age and exposure to oil. In the process of adjusting your tone arm and replacing the needle, you might have moved it from the position it had been resting in for the past 30 years.

When the mech moves the tone arm over the initial groove on the record and releases it, there is a moment when the arm isn't being guided, it's simply free falling- albeit a very short distance.

If the tonearm wire is stiff, it will move that arm away from the starting position during the drop. Watch and see if that is what's happening, replace it for a sure fix, or try adjusting it's position to "get by".
 
The wire running from the tonearm down to the amp may be hardened from age and exposure to oil. In the process of adjusting your tone arm and replacing the needle, you might have moved it from the position it had been resting in for the past 30 years.

When the mech moves the tone arm over the initial groove on the record and releases it, there is a moment when the arm isn't being guided, it's simply free falling- albeit a very short distance.

If the tonearm wire is stiff, it will move that arm away from the starting position during the drop. Watch and see if that is what's happening, replace it for a sure fix, or try adjusting it's position to "get by".


I watched the arm drop a few times, and for some reason it looked like it wasn't quite clearing the edge of the record when swinging. I raised the metal stopper arm that sits on the lifting mechanism about 1/8 of an inch and it doesn't have a problem skipping when starting anymore. I was also able to get in and clean a few of the more problematic records. Skipping has definitely lessened... but there is still some random skipping. It seems to happen on newer records. 50's and 60's records don't really skip. The problem starts with late 70's and 80's records. May be completely coincidence, but I thought it was odd.

I need to go check out the ebay auction where I purchased the needle. I am not sure it was a genuine Shure needle. It also seems to be a quieter volume with the new needle.
 
I need to go check out the ebay auction where I purchased the needle. I am not sure it was a genuine Shure needle. It also seems to be a quieter volume with the new needle.


What size was the replacement needle?
Newer records have tighter grooves than the older ones. (Most are also mono)
If you've got the wrong size needle (say for 78's) you will have similar problems (frequent skipping, light sound) because the needle does not sit deep enough into the grooves.
It'll also mess up your records. I think you should have a .7mm but check and be shure. (sorry for the pun)
 
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