Punchout palette logic poll

ajcrm125

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Ok so I'm looking at the schematics for the CHP1-BAK PCB in the punchout PCB stack. I notice that the muxes located at 7J,7K,8J,8K are all 74353's according to the schematic. But I'm working on 2 sets and they both have 153's instead.

Is this just an error in the schematics?
I'm curious if any of you PO owners have 353's in those positions.
(353 is same as 153 except it has inverted outputs)
 
I'll check some in a bit but what revision schematic and what revision boards are you looking at?

Also can you tell if the boards you are looking at have white or pink labeled proms?
 
I just checked the three I have.....one had 74LS153's, one has 74LS353's, and one has 74LS352's. All three of mine are CHP1-01-BAK. All also look factory. These BAK boards can be a mess. Different ROMs versions, different bi-polar PROM versions....and they can't be mixes (bi-polar PROMs have to match the ROMs). All kinds of crazy ROMs (2564 EPROMs, 3864 masked ROMs, 2763 EPROMs).

Here's a thread...I outlined some of my findings while fixing a stack of these.

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=109299&highlight=punch

Edward
 
Slight correction of above information:

74ls352 is inverted version of 74ls153.
74ls353 = 74ls352 except when the enable line is high(off). The 74ls353 goes to high impedance and the 74ls352 goes high.

The 353/352 difference probably doesn't really matter although I'm not sure if I would of used the 353.
 
Ok so I'm looking at the schematics for the CHP1-BAK PCB in the punchout PCB stack. I notice that the muxes located at 7J,7K,8J,8K are all 74353's according to the schematic. But I'm working on 2 sets and they both have 153's instead.

Is this just an error in the schematics?
I'm curious if any of you PO owners have 353's in those positions.
(353 is same as 153 except it has inverted outputs)

Mine are are all 352p on version02
 
I'll check some in a bit but what revision schematic and what revision boards are you looking at?

Also can you tell if the boards you are looking at have white or pink labeled proms?

I didn't realize there was another schematic rev out there. Can you point me to a copy?
 
Looks like you've almost hit the jackpot in variety.

This prob explains the various graphical ROM/palette prom combinations mentioned in that other post. If the muxes are inverted, you'll need to either change the prom or have different EPROMS programmed with inverted data.
 
There are 2 board revisions 01 and 02. I uploaded the 02 schematics and thought I had uploaded 01s, but it looks like I haven't. When I get a chance I'll have to go to Kinkos and have them scan them and upload them.

That being said it looks like at least with the -01 version they stuffed different parts. I know the proms came in different versions and have the differences between at least one version of the 01 with the 02 EPROMs, but it appears there are more.

Do you guys think we can coordinate an attack on this with what we have to get the dumps organized together and record what is located at 6J,7J,8J,6K,7K, and 8K for each dump?
 
There are 2 board revisions 01 and 02. I uploaded the 02 schematics and thought I had uploaded 01s, but it looks like I haven't. When I get a chance I'll have to go to Kinkos and have them scan them and upload them.

That being said it looks like at least with the -01 version they stuffed different parts. I know the proms came in different versions and have the differences between at least one version of the 01 with the 02 EPROMs, but it appears there are more.

Do you guys think we can coordinate an attack on this with what we have to get the dumps organized together and record what is located at 6J,7J,8J,6K,7K, and 8K for each dump?

I think that's a good idea. My suspicion is that the ROM contents are simply inverted. Unless there's something else in the datapath that inverts the deata before it gets to the muxes. I'll know once I compare the schematics.

You said you uploaded Rev2 of the schematics? Where abouts can I download that?
Thanks!
 
I think that's a good idea. My suspicion is that the ROM contents are simply inverted. Unless there's something else in the datapath that inverts the deata before it gets to the muxes. I'll know once I compare the schematics.

You said you uploaded Rev2 of the schematics? Where abouts can I download that?
Thanks!

http://arcarc.xmission.com/PDF_Arcade_Nintendo/

Edward
 
Elutz, do you have the ability to dump your EPROMs and Proms? I think we've talked about this before, but I've forgotten.
 
Those all say Revision 1 on the pages.

That is the revision of the schematic. Revision 1 for the -02 PCBs. If you look at a Nintendo PCB it reads, Model#-Revision-Board Name. The Schematics on arcarc are for CHP1-02-XX Boards which you can see are silk screened on the PCB. Nintendo also has a CHP1-01-XX PCB set.
 
Elutz, do you have the ability to dump your EPROMs and Proms? I think we've talked about this before, but I've forgotten.

Sadly, no. I've got an old Data I/O I never use. I could dig it out and figure out how to connect it to my computer, and probably get the bi-polar's......I have no idea if it'll read the other oddball stuff (3864 ROMs, 2564 EPROMs, 2763 EPROMs). This is the only time I've ever encountered a 2763 EPROM!

Edward
 
You would just need to read them as the standard EPROM that fit that board IIRC. I believe I read the 2763 as a 2764. If you can't, I could read them for you if you don't mind being without them for a few days. I was thinking about contacting you about tubes anyways. Maybe it won't be necessary and ajcrm125 and myself could put it together, but I think you have a variety which would be nice to just dump.
 
That is the revision of the schematic. Revision 1 for the -02 PCBs. If you look at a Nintendo PCB it reads, Model#-Revision-Board Name. The Schematics on arcarc are for CHP1-02-XX Boards which you can see are silk screened on the PCB. Nintendo also has a CHP1-01-XX PCB set.

Yeah, Nintendo made it nice and confusing.
Revision 1 = CHP1-02-XXX
No revision = CHP1-01-XXX

I honestly dont know if revision even matters, especially in regards to the color output section. I've seen traces cut and factory jumpers on the BAK boards to accommodate different ROMs/EPROMs. Different chips at 7J/7K/8J/8K/6J/6K.....all on the same version of the BAK board.

Edward
 
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