Playchoice 10 - new game?

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Hey, for a while I've considered trying to release a PC10 cartridge. You see, one of my hobbies is programming the Nintendo Entertainment System - it's the same hardware. I already have a good idea of how to do the PCB, it's just (the usual) matter of having the software written.

So if I do it, I'll do it for my own entertainment mostly, but I'm curious if there is much support for this kind of development.

One issue is the security system, if it's not bypassed then it may be able to work by plugging an existing cart in, to pass-through the security I/O. Another is that noticed the other carts don't seem to be very tall at all, is there going to be a problem with the extra height? I have no idea what different cabinets there are for it, I seem to remember seeing quite a few odd ones.
 
don't know much about this but the carts do probably need to be small or short because most PC 10 motherboards slide into a metal cage. since the carts plug into the mother board they would need to be short enough to still fit in the cage when plugged in. I do seem to remember someone had made an adapter that would allow you to play original NES carts through any PC10 board. This was never sold just a single harness or unit that someone made for themselves. I also know that some folks have used parts from original NES carts and combined them with PC10 carts to make certain NES games playable on a PC10.
 
I guess it matters if we like the new game you make. I don'nt think people would buy a DK2 Kit and all that if we did'nt allready like DK, Mario, allready.
 
Let me get this straight....

you are going to try to take an existing NES cartridge like Adventure Island, Castlevania 3, Kirby's Adventure, or even Blaster Master and try to hotwire/ configure/ mod the game so that it can be plugged in and played on any Playchoice-10 board?
 
I guess I will need to see what this metal cage looks like, how much room I have to work with. Maybe it could expand the other way and block off some other slots, but that seems kinda dumb..

Let me get this straight....

you are going to try to take an existing NES cartridge like Adventure Island, Castlevania 3, Kirby's Adventure, or even Blaster Master and try to hotwire/ configure/ mod the game so that it can be plugged in and played on any Playchoice-10 board?

No, I would make a new (PC10) cartridge, with whatever hardware I need, including EPROMs with my own stuff on it. An existing PC10 cartridge would have to plug into my board (to bypass the security). It won't be any good for running older games, it's a new design. Theoretically one could use whatever hardware and/or hack the ROMs just as easily, but there's no fun in making bootleg carts, if you know how to code. :)

Unfortunately there is no source for NES cart connectors (the replacement connectors available are inappropriate), so any kind of NES to PC10 adapter would be kind of a mess that I don't want to attempt, since I don't even have a Playchoice cabinet myself.
 
I guess I will need to see what this metal cage looks like, how much room I have to work with. Maybe it could expand the other way and block off some other slots, but that seems kinda dumb..



No, I would make a new (PC10) cartridge, with whatever hardware I need, including EPROMs with my own stuff on it. An existing PC10 cartridge would have to plug into my board (to bypass the security). It won't be any good for running older games, it's a new design. Theoretically one could use whatever hardware and/or hack the ROMs just as easily, but there's no fun in making bootleg carts, if you know how to code. :)

Unfortunately there is no source for NES cart connectors (the replacement connectors available are inappropriate), so any kind of NES to PC10 adapter would be kind of a mess that I don't want to attempt, since I don't even have a Playchoice cabinet myself.

ah, I see. interesting.
 
Not saying it's proof as I did not see the thing working but I do remember seeing pics of the harness connected to the motherboard with the nintendo cart connected on the other end.
 
http://seesharpsharp.blogspot.com/2008/02/playchoice-10-and-nes-cartridge-musings.html

I deleted my other post as I was referring to something supposedly built several years ago. this apparently is a new project, by a different guy and sounds pretty legit!

Oh, and here is a handy bit of info for the Op:

"The PC10 apparently uses a standard edge connector, in particular a 3x32 male eurocard connector. This means I don't need to murder any more game paks to make a batch of adapters, and as a bonus, a footprint pattern already exists for it in pcb123, 41612 din eurocard. For some reason it calls it a 98 pin connector, but it's not. I guess the artist couldn't count right - or maybe counted the screw holes? "
 
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http://members.verizon.net/~vze3b3qa/pc10/pc_10nes.htm

You might consider creating a new game for the Vs instead of PC-10. That just uses ROMs or sometimes daughter boards, and is actually closer to the regular NES, I believe. Also, I don't have my PC-10 mobo in a cage, so space is no problem. You do need to take into account the single monitor/dual monitor issue in your programming, and the same cart work on either.
 
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Yeah, I'm familiar with Oliver Achten's PC10 BIOS hack, I've hosted it on my site (http://nesdev.parodius.com/ - lots of NES technical info). I wish there were normal NES cart connectors available, as I have several project ideas to use them in. But yeah I was happy to see the Playchoice uses standard connectors.

I have been curious about the VS system as well. Unless it will take cheap 28-pin EPROMs (I already have an absurd number of blank 27C512s), I'm afraid it would get too difficult/expensive to buy a bunch of small EPROMs. I don't know what type of EPROMs they normally use. I'd kinda hate to displace an old Nintendo game, but if it could save the hardware from getting stripped maybe it's not a bad idea. I kinda doubt there are many original VS Golf cabinets around anymore, heh.

The good thing with the VS is that it lets the NES program read the coin input, so it can play like an arcade game rather than being timed.
The bad thing is that the VS game kit itself includes a PPU, so the graphics chip has the colors scrambled for each game. I imagine that was to stop arcade ops from swapping out the EPROMs for free. That might be a show-stopper, as I don't know for sure if every color is in every VS PPU. Hopefully it's just scrambled, then it's only a matter of ROM revisions.

On a somewhat related note, many years ago I made a song for 2 NES's, I split the ROM apart and made MAME run it as a VS Dualsystem (and running a simple game I coded, but only on one side). It was kinda funny.
 
Luckily, there are actually only a few different PPUs. Several games will use the same one, not a different one for every single game out there.
 
Yeah, I'm familiar with Oliver Achten's PC10 BIOS hack, I've hosted it on my site (http://nesdev.parodius.com/ - lots of NES technical info). I wish there were normal NES cart connectors available, as I have several project ideas to use them in. But yeah I was happy to see the Playchoice uses standard connectors.

I have been curious about the VS system as well. Unless it will take cheap 28-pin EPROMs (I already have an absurd number of blank 27C512s), I'm afraid it would get too difficult/expensive to buy a bunch of small EPROMs. I don't know what type of EPROMs they normally use. I'd kinda hate to displace an old Nintendo game, but if it could save the hardware from getting stripped maybe it's not a bad idea. I kinda doubt there are many original VS Golf cabinets around anymore, heh.

The good thing with the VS is that it lets the NES program read the coin input, so it can play like an arcade game rather than being timed.
The bad thing is that the VS game kit itself includes a PPU, so the graphics chip has the colors scrambled for each game. I imagine that was to stop arcade ops from swapping out the EPROMs for free. That might be a show-stopper, as I don't know for sure if every color is in every VS PPU. Hopefully it's just scrambled, then it's only a matter of ROM revisions.

On a somewhat related note, many years ago I made a song for 2 NES's, I split the ROM apart and made MAME run it as a VS Dualsystem (and running a simple game I coded, but only on one side). It was kinda funny.

Nintendo Vs. uses the 2764 ROMS and the games are easy to convert if they use the same PPU. See my site here:

http://johnsarcade.com/nintendo_vs_ppu_info.php
 
One potential source for the NES connectors is Game Genies. Obviously you can't purchase in bulk, but they are at least available.

I have followed several projects to make a NES to Playchoice adapter, but they all seem to die right before producing any results.
 
OK, here's the plan so far. My friend has a VS board he will give me, but I don't know if I'll be able to hook it up anytime soon. I'll be fine though, between testing on my NES and emulators on the PC. For now I'll just have to hope that the unused pin (pin 26) on the 27C64 is actually connected to something.

It may be a while before anything is ready for release, but it looks like this is something I'll be able to do with the parts I already have.
 
For now I'll just have to hope that the unused pin (pin 26) on the 27C64 is actually connected to something.

Pin 26 is not generally connected to anything. There was an app note from Nintendo where they gave instructions on how to hook up pin 26 which was needed for some games, but only on one socket. It is possible Nintendo hard wired it on later revisions of the board, but I imagine it would be for one socket.
 
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