The only advantage that I know of is it's about $10 less and you can get it cut in 10 minutes.
Glennon
Pinball Glass
- Thread starter FrizzleFried
- Start date
Glennon
Who are you talking about? KenThank you! That was exactly what I was thinking, but you beat me to the post! And yes folks, a lot of modern windows ARE made of tempered glass, especially the large ones used in commercial buildings. Why? Strength for one, but more importantly, LIABILITY CONCERNS when the glass gets broken.
You also don't generally have the opportunity to put part of your body weight in a downward fashion on a window, picture frame, etc. like you might if you happen to rest your elbows on a playfield glass, or if one of your kids jumps up on top of your pins while you're not looking (if you think this won't happen you don't have kids), etc. If you think plate glass in a window isn't potentially dangerous, go lean all your body weight up against one so you break through it, and see if you're lucky enough to not get seriously cut in the process.
And I never claimed tempered glass doesn't break - I absolutely said it can break easily if hit at the edges. Good thing all edges are completely concealed and protected when it's in a pinball machine. It can take an amazing amount of abuse on the flat surfaces, which is why it is used in this application. And when it does break, it's in a huge number of tiny pieces which cannot make anything more than annoying small cuts if you were to come into contact with them.
As far as plate glass use in games from 1977-back, does it not occur to you that the change came into play EXACTLY at the transition period from EM to solid state...that higher powered flippers and faster playing games in the solid state era require this level of safety?
You should go back to answering questions on monitors and what have you, and leave the pinball playfield glass questions alone. Your head is buried deep in the sand and your unwillingness to listen to reason and experience is of epic ignorance...and those that blindly follow you are equally ignorant.
Seriously, the "advice" you have offered here is some of the worst I have ever seen. It's sort of the pinball equivalent of telling people to run old style monitors without an isolation transformer, it's OK to plug your 100V Sanyo into your house wall socket, and there's no reason to power down the monitor before removing the high tension line from the tube...
Richard
OP
OP
The single advantage I can think of is that it's MUCH easier to clean up broken plate glass...
...but rest assured, I'll be getting tempered.
You of course have some stats to back up how dangerous it is to use plate glass in pinball machines right? I agree with the point that it is safer to use tempered glass ,I would just like to see some kind of study or stats from maybe an operator who had pinball machines on route for years to vallidate what your saying. Also Ken is a well repected member here and there are alot beter ways to disagree with him than name calling.Thank you! That was exactly what I was thinking, but you beat me to the post! And yes folks, a lot of modern windows ARE made of tempered glass, especially the large ones used in commercial buildings. Why? Strength for one, but more importantly, LIABILITY CONCERNS when the glass gets broken.
You also don't generally have the opportunity to put part of your body weight in a downward fashion on a window, picture frame, etc. like you might if you happen to rest your elbows on a playfield glass, or if one of your kids jumps up on top of your pins while you're not looking (if you think this won't happen you don't have kids), etc. If you think plate glass in a window isn't potentially dangerous, go lean all your body weight up against one so you break through it, and see if you're lucky enough to not get seriously cut in the process.
And I never claimed tempered glass doesn't break - I absolutely said it can break easily if hit at the edges. Good thing all edges are completely concealed and protected when it's in a pinball machine. It can take an amazing amount of abuse on the flat surfaces, which is why it is used in this application. And when it does break, it's in a huge number of tiny pieces which cannot make anything more than annoying small cuts if you were to come into contact with them.
As far as plate glass use in games from 1977-back, does it not occur to you that the change came into play EXACTLY at the transition period from EM to solid state...that higher powered flippers and faster playing games in the solid state era require this level of safety?
You should go back to answering questions on monitors and what have you, and leave the pinball playfield glass questions alone. Your head is buried deep in the sand and your unwillingness to listen to reason and experience is of epic ignorance...and those that blindly follow you are equally ignorant.
Seriously, the "advice" you have offered here is some of the worst I have ever seen. It's sort of the pinball equivalent of telling people to run old style monitors without an isolation transformer, it's OK to plug your 100V Sanyo into your house wall socket, and there's no reason to power down the monitor before removing the high tension line from the tube...
Richard
Glennon
Who started this crap. LOL Hey frizz next time use the search option. Go Steelers.
Glennon
Lindsey
Well-known member
The problem with cleaning up broken plate glass is it's dangerous and what the hell do you do with these giant knives you've now got? I guess if you're in a shop with a dumpster out back it's not big deal but in my home a giant sheet of broken plate glass is a nightmare to deal with. I would take the cleanup on broken tempered over broken plate in most cases but obviously that won't be true for everyone. Grab a good vacuum and it shouldn't take long. Cleanup can be a pain on pinball though to be sure.
Lindsey
Well-known member
You mean like Clay Harrell? Someone like that, right?
It's a damn shame there's no on like that who's advice we could call upon. Oh well.
OP
OP
Hey hey hey....all I asked was WHERE to pick up some pinball glass. I fully intended to get the tempered stuff from the get-go.
Lindsey
Well-known member
Technically we would have to say Ken started it. I think it was pretty obvious what was going to happen after that.
Speaking of glass. Looks like Terry is going to be selling glass for $20 at expo. Does anyone know a good cheap way to ship like 20 pieces from Chicago to Canada? In Canada I've shipped heavy stuff cheap with greyhound but I don't know if they do that across the border. I kind of doubt it because of customs. I should really start a new thread for this. haha
Speaking of glass. Looks like Terry is going to be selling glass for $20 at expo. Does anyone know a good cheap way to ship like 20 pieces from Chicago to Canada? In Canada I've shipped heavy stuff cheap with greyhound but I don't know if they do that across the border. I kind of doubt it because of customs. I should really start a new thread for this. haha
A lot of people's reasoning for using plate in a pinball is the easy of cleanup when it breaks...just a few big shards. While with tempered......you end with 1000s of little squares. I have personally seen plate break in a pinball machine. Trust me, it ain't that easy. Yes, you have a handful of big sharp shards........you also end up with 1000s of little needle size daggers. A vacuum is still needed, glass "debris" get everywhere.....it is just as big of a pain in the ass as cleaning up tempered glass.....well, except for....all the debris is razor sharp.
Edward
Edward
butthead
New member
Look at car glass. Sides and Back are tempered.
Windshield is Regular Glass with a Inner lamination to help hold it together in case of accident. Otherwise it would self destruct with the first rock hit if it were tempered.
50/50 In my Book. And yes tempered will cut you.I punched out a side window once. Lots of Stiches and Blood.
Windshield is Regular Glass with a Inner lamination to help hold it together in case of accident. Otherwise it would self destruct with the first rock hit if it were tempered.
50/50 In my Book. And yes tempered will cut you.I punched out a side window once. Lots of Stiches and Blood.
Lindsey
Well-known member
How is that relevant? Unless I missed the part where we were talking about using laminated windshield glass in pinball machines.
butthead
New member
You Have a Outer Glass Laminated to a Inner Glass. It can take more Inpact than Tempered, Yes due to it is laminated, But it still cracks and breaks.
Tempered just Blows up leaving little pieces of glass everywhere.
Say I drop my hammer on a pin.
1 = 12 trillion pieces. Tempered, Going to be here all night
2 = 8 to 10 Big Pieces and a little vac. Job 5 mins.
WadeLanham
Well-known member
That wasn't because it was tempered and sharp, it was because you punched a solid object with enough force to cause stitches and bleeding. Same would have happened to yoru hand if you punched a brick wall. Doesn't mean the brick wall is sharp.
Wade
Lindsey
Well-known member
You just said the same thing again so I'll ask again how windshield glass has any relevance.
WadeLanham
Well-known member
First of all, I'd argue that the dropped hammer wouldn't usually break the tempered glass because it is THAT much stronger than regular plate glass. When I break tempered to put it in the trash, it always surprises me how hard I have to pound on it to get it to break. Regular glass is FAR easier to break but FAR harder and more dangerous to clean up!!
Second... OK, so we've established that laziness and cheapness is the motivating factor for those who want to save $10 and are too lazy to clean up their pin of tempered glass breaks. Glad that's been clarified.
So if you want to be lazy and cheap, and expose yourself, family, friends, and future owners of your game to unnecessary danger and liability... get the plate glass. (Who would possibly be in this group by choice??)
Like someone else said, I only hope that it's the guys who choose to install plate glass in their pins who end up injured... not some kid, visitor, or someone else who didn't make the bad decision.
It really is a simple decision. But sometimes people will rationalize even the dumbest ideas. You can always count on someone to do that.
Wade
butthead
New member
Sorry But you spelled your wrong. Better fix that fast Actually my arm suffered the injurys. Yes the Volkswagon got the best of me.
Then I got out the sledge Hammer a buck a shot I made some money.
Shit Dad was pissed when he came back from Vacation, Poor old Dasher dead.
Sorry Dad
WadeLanham
Well-known member
I've seen or known it to break a few times, I'm surprised you've been so lucky...
It really is stupid to use plate glass in a pin.
1) It's right next to the player's hands
2) it's an amusement device where people/kids are often having fun and perhaps getting a little to rowdy around (if not your friends/family, then someone down the road)
3) metal balls fly around nearby and often smack the glass
4) sometimes people lean/climb/rest on the glass
5) tempered glass is affordable and available.
I'm not saying that you're stupid, but it is stupid not to use tempered glass in a pin. Cheap insurance, you know?
Wade
SgtSmackaho
Well-known member
How can I tell what glass is in my machine?
