Pay to have a game shopped?

Zoghd

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First of all, I figure you typically maintain and service your games yourself. but.....

Whats the average price you should pay a retail store to shop your game?

If hourly, what is the rate per?

In house or to take it to their shop?

Any info would be greatly appreciated!!

I ask because I bought a DK TKG3 Cocktail Table from what I thought was a trustworthy retailer. We walked in to browse and my wife wanted the DK as soon as she saw it. She is NOT a gamer but had memories of playing it with her family. The owner was there and he acted as the sales man. I was told the DK would be shopped, cleaned and touched up before delivery. We bought it (and more). It was delivered to my house without any of the promised services done and multiple technical issues popped up immediately. probably due to the filth inside of the table. Not the dirtiest I have ever seen but it ranks up there. They have come over 5 times since delivery to fix various issues. Now that it is at least working, the company and I are discussing resolutions. So....

I expect to discuss with them in more detail tomorrow and your input would beneficial. THANKS!
 
First of all, I figure you typically maintain and service your games yourself. but.....

Whats the average price you should pay a retail store to shop your game?

If hourly, what is the rate per?

In house or to take it to their shop?

Any info would be greatly appreciated!!

I ask because I bought a DK TKG3 Cocktail Table from what I thought was a trustworthy retailer. We walked in to browse and my wife wanted the DK as soon as she saw it. She is NOT a gamer but had memories of playing it with her family. The owner was there and he acted as the sales man. I was told the DK would be shopped, cleaned and touched up before delivery. We bought it (and more). It was delivered to my house without any of the promised services done and multiple technical issues popped up immediately. probably due to the filth inside of the table. Not the dirtiest I have ever seen but it ranks up there. They have come over 5 times since delivery to fix various issues. Now that it is at least working, the company and I are discussing resolutions. So....

I expect to discuss with them in more detail tomorrow and your input would beneficial. THANKS!

The issue here is what do you consider "Shopped". That definition is anything from "Wiped down with windex" to "Totally disassembled and cleaned, rebuilt everything".

If it's a simple cleaning thing, I would do it myself. If it's a total rebuild, you could be looking at a lot of money depending on whether it's simple (video game), or quite involved (pinball).
 
The issue here is what do you consider "Shopped". That definition is anything from "Wiped down with windex" to "Totally disassembled and cleaned, rebuilt everything".

If it's a simple cleaning thing, I would do it myself. If it's a total rebuild, you could be looking at a lot of money depending on whether it's simple (video game), or quite involved (pinball).

Ditto to everything you've said. I would also suggest you are always better to take it in to be shopped if it all possible. Being in their shop means they have all their tools/parts/supplies accessible and they shouldn't be under as much time pressure and can do a more through job.

When talking to someone about shopping a game it is best to find out specifically what THEY do when shopping it. If the game is old, it is also best to find out if they include re-capping the monitor as well.
 
First of all, I figure you typically maintain and service your games yourself. but.....

Whats the average price you should pay a retail store to shop your game?

If hourly, what is the rate per?

In house or to take it to their shop?

Any info would be greatly appreciated!!

I ask because I bought a DK TKG3 Cocktail Table from what I thought was a trustworthy retailer. We walked in to browse and my wife wanted the DK as soon as she saw it. She is NOT a gamer but had memories of playing it with her family. The owner was there and he acted as the sales man. I was told the DK would be shopped, cleaned and touched up before delivery. We bought it (and more). It was delivered to my house without any of the promised services done and multiple technical issues popped up immediately. probably due to the filth inside of the table. Not the dirtiest I have ever seen but it ranks up there. They have come over 5 times since delivery to fix various issues. Now that it is at least working, the company and I are discussing resolutions. So....

I expect to discuss with them in more detail tomorrow and your input would beneficial. THANKS!

Do you happen to live in Tennessee?
 
The issue here is what do you consider "Shopped". That definition is anything from "Wiped down with windex" to "Totally disassembled and cleaned, rebuilt everything".

I hear you there! I knew this going in and asked the owner for clarification. The understanding was that the boards, chips and insides would be cleaned as well as some of the cosmetics being addressed. Neither of which happened.

The insides, boards included, were covered in a heavy layer of dirt/dust. Many technical problems came up one after the other. All of which were due to dirty boards. Plus I was told after one service visit that he had cleaned up the boards only to find that he wiped down the top most visible edges and nothing else.

I knew I was paying way more than necessary but was willing for the conveniences of buying from a well known local retailer with decades in the same location and to have the cleaning and touch ups done. My family and friends have gone there for years and I really hate to see this happen.

Plus this single transaction has a bunch of other baggage that goes along with it. Another unit (old EM machine) I purchased at the same time has further complicated the matter. The EM was being rebuilt when we bought it and was actually a good deal. But they could not get it fixed and deemed it a lost cause. Now I have a dirty DK Table next to a GT 99 kit in a beat up Dynamo HS-5 Cab with pretty rough controls as a "loaner" game (as collateral towards store credit).

So as I look over their offers I would like to have the value/cost to have.....

the boards (4 DK boards including the piggy back) cleaned properly? chips removed, reseated and all?

hmmmph
 
@ Daddy- No why? Similar experience maybe?
 
The issue here is what do you consider "Shopped". That definition is anything from "Wiped down with windex" to "Totally disassembled and cleaned, rebuilt everything".

I hear you there! I knew this going in and asked the owner for clarification. The understanding was that the boards, chips and insides would be cleaned as well as some of the cosmetics being addressed. Neither of which happened.

The insides, boards included, were covered in a heavy layer of dirt/dust. Many technical problems came up one after the other. All of which were due to dirty boards. Plus I was told after one service visit that he had cleaned up the boards only to find that he wiped down the top most visible edges and nothing else.

I knew I was paying way more than necessary but was willing for the conveniences of buying from a well known local retailer with decades in the same location and to have the cleaning and touch ups done. My family and friends have gone there for years and I really hate to see this happen.

Plus this single transaction has a bunch of other baggage that goes along with it. Another unit (old EM machine) I purchased at the same time has further complicated the matter. The EM was being rebuilt when we bought it and was actually a good deal. But they could not get it fixed and deemed it a lost cause. Now I have a dirty DK Table next to a GT 99 kit in a beat up Dynamo HS-5 Cab with pretty rough controls as a "loaner" game (as collateral towards store credit).

So as I look over their offers I would like to have the value/cost to have.....

the boards (4 DK boards including the piggy back) cleaned properly? chips removed, reseated and all?

hmmmph

I generally don't reseat chips unless there is an issue. I will give them a firm press to make sure they are fully seated and if there are contact issues that will generally solve it.

As far as board cleaning, you can go anywhere from blowing them off with an air duster to running them through your dish washer. I generally give them a good blowing off myself. It won't remove ALL the dust but it generally takes care of most of it. It is rare to see dust buildup alone causing an issue. If so, then you probably have a more serious issue of a component that is on the edge of failing.

If you paid for an EM pinball that they decided couldn't be salvaged, then you should just get your money back plain and simple. I would not do a store credit or a loaner. I would just want a full refund then decide when and if to buy another machine from them in the future.

At a minimum the cabinet should be throughly blown/vacummed out. Boards blown off, monitor bezels/glass all removed and cleaned. Marquee removed and cleaned along with cleaning lamps. Machine should be throughly wiped down. Control panel grime fully cleaned off, buttons cleaned. All control panel elements tightened. Coin mechs checked and adjusted/cleaned. Replace burned out lamps. Cabinet cosmetics touched up. Monitor adjustmeans all tweaked and degaussed if necessary. Power Supply voltages checked both for proper DC voltages and any AC ripple.

This is what I consider the minimum of what should be done. Depending on the game age, I also encourage the monitor being recapped.
 
I generally don't reseat chips unless there is an issue. I will give them a firm press to make sure they are fully seated and if there are contact issues that will generally solve it.

As far as board cleaning, you can go anywhere from blowing them off with an air duster to running them through your dish washer. I generally give them a good blowing off myself. It won't remove ALL the dust but it generally takes care of most of it. It is rare to see dust buildup alone causing an issue. If so, then you probably have a more serious issue of a component that is on the edge of failing.

If you paid for an EM pinball that they decided couldn't be salvaged, then you should just get your money back plain and simple. I would not do a store credit or a loaner. I would just want a full refund then decide when and if to buy another machine from them in the future.

At a minimum the cabinet should be throughly blown/vacummed out. Boards blown off, monitor bezels/glass all removed and cleaned. Marquee removed and cleaned along with cleaning lamps. Machine should be throughly wiped down. Control panel grime fully cleaned off, buttons cleaned. All control panel elements tightened. Coin mechs checked and adjusted/cleaned. Replace burned out lamps. Cabinet cosmetics touched up. Monitor adjustmeans all tweaked and degaussed if necessary. Power Supply voltages checked both for proper DC voltages and any AC ripple.

This is what I consider the minimum of what should be done. Depending on the game age, I also encourage the monitor being recapped.
blair - Sending PM
 
I value the feedback from everyone. If anyone could share an approximate retail price on having the boards, connections etc. cleaned i would appreciate it!
 
If you live in Mich, I can restore your DK for a resonable amount once it's seen and we agree on what you want done.

Otherwise expect, approx $40-$50 an hour I would say for board repair, connectors and cleaning.

Lastly, I personally would keep the DK and tell them to come get the other machine and issue you a refund and go buy elsewhere. This place does not sound like they have their act together but still want to sell machines.
 
Just curious, what issues is the Donkey Kong having? While dirt, grim, dust, etc. is ugly/unsightly/stinky/nasty........it isn't the source of your electrical problems. Filth does not make a game unrealible.

Edward
 
Dirt on the boards isn't your problem. It may be nice to have a clean, shiny board, but external dust isn't usually any problem. The chips don't care if they're dirty or not. Now, dirty contacts, corroding pins, etc - those cause problems. Things like the 8035 getting tarnished legs and not making contact (some sounds go away), etc.

"Shopped" traditionally means that the operator brings the game back to the shop - vacuums it out, and cleans it up a bit, replacing broken parts and fixing bad field repairs. Take the bezel off, clean it and the picture tube, adjust/repair the monitor as needed. Clean/replace the coin mechs, be sure all the switches work. A new bulb in the marquee if it's out. Maybe if they had time, paint over or clean off graffiti, try to make the game look a bit better. But "shopping" a game is not a restore. It's just fixing it up to get it ready for a new location. And really, that's fine. A shopped game should work, and work well. It's not going to be factory-fresh, the insides won't be spotless, and it's not going to be fully restored. Some people on this forum do an amazing job on their restores, making the games look even better than they did when they were new. But that's just the collector OCD. An operator will shop a game to make it work right so it can make more money.

You say the game has broken many times - what were the failures? What were they doing to fix it? Monitor problems (picture collapses, folds over, smears), or board problems (lockups, garbled screen, missing sounds)? Moving an old game usually wiggles connectors around and can make it not work - especially if all the internal parts weren't properly secured the last time it was apart. But once set where it's going to go, it should be fine.

Again, dirt and dust on the boards isn't going to cause them to not work. If it did, then none of the games I've ever bought should have worked. Cleaning the boards yourself is trivial - just pull them out, and use a paintbrush to dislodge dust while blowing it with a can of air. If they're really filthy, you can wash them in the sink or use the dishwasher - but I generally only go to those extremes if it's real bad, and I need to repair them (it's hard to work on a dirty board, since the traces are hard to see). But most common dust should just brush right off.

When you hear people talk of "dirty contacts", it's usually not so much from external dirt as it is from corrosion or tarnish on the chip pins - in theory, the dirt shouldn't be able to get between the chip pins and the socket, since a good socket makes a very tight seal with the chip. That said, some old sockets are kind of crummy. Donkey Kong is better than most, Atari used some really terrible sockets though. Generally, cleaning all the chip pins isn't done unless there is a problem - you usually just push them down into the sockets to make sure they are seated properly.

-Ian
 
Just curious, what issues is the Donkey Kong having? While dirt, grim, dust, etc. is ugly/unsightly/stinky/nasty........it isn't the source of your electrical problems. Filth does not make a game unrealible.

Edward
The following glitches occured independantly of each other after each service call unless noted:

1. The screen would sporadically put up purplish vertical lines (resolved)
2. The background music as well as some other sound effects were missing (resolved)
3. A sound effect (jump I believe) would stick and stay on until shut down (resolved)
4. 20 minutes after the tech left from resolving issue 3 the following occured: (It should be noted that "3" was fixed using a can of contact cleaner sprayed at the boards liberally while they were still in the table until dripping.)
While on the credits screen and waiting for 1 or 2 player to be pressed the game began to cycle through most of the sound effects in what appeared to be no particular order without break between any sfx. Typically there is no sound on this screen. After having continued for about a minute, while I attempted to find my cell to video the incident, my daughter pressed player 1. (gotta love kids^^) This stopped the SFX, and resulted in static, buzzing and me shutting down the machine and calling the tech again. When I turned the unit on again through the following day, this would repeat and once the buzzing began then sfx and background music were missing.

When the tech returned the next day I was prepared with research (http://www.brasington.org/arcade/tech/dk/) and had each chips function and location handy. I offered it to him when he got to the house but he didn't want it at first. Not actually understanding what I was reading I ended up, an hour into his visit and various statements such as "what is this?" and "Thats different." etc later, I ended up instructing him which boards/chips to check remove, clean and reseat. Each time he came over he said "something must be dirty, a chip or connection maybe."

These were just the electronic issues. Lock and key issues accompanied 1-3. My favorite being "This lid will never lock down because someone must have broken into it at one time because the latches are missing." I pointed to the one remaining latch and he said. "That one doesn't work." That was visit 2. Eventually they sent a different tech to fabricate a latch and when he arrived he used the one I pointed out the previous week without any adjustments or fabrication but just by putting in a new lock.

The reason I ask what the rate would be to clean reseat etc. Is because they didnt shop it as promised before delivery and it still hasn't been. The price point would be to identify a fair partial refund on my purchase.


Thoughts?
 
I just wanted to say sorry for your problems, it's a shame that you are having so many problems; and it sounds like you have purchased a lemon. If i was you, i would try to get a refund. Would it be bad form to ask how much you have paid for your unit?

Did you try the machine when you were at the shop? I would not be surprised if the game was somehow damaged during shipping
 
(It should be noted that "3" was fixed using a can of contact cleaner sprayed at the boards liberally while they were still in the table until dripping.)

Thoughts?

The guy is an idiot. That's not how you clean chip pins. Was it "TV Tuner Cleaner", by any chance? That stuff has no business being near boards. It'll just leave this nasty oily film and attract more dirt. It might help, but it'll be temporary at best.

What he needed to do was remove the socketed chips, clean the legs, and reinsert them. If the boards are totally filthy, brushing it off first would be a good idea, to keep it out of the sockets.

Once I have a problem with a board like that, I usually clean it, simply to make it easier to work on. But then again, I don't fix all my problems by spraying them with an aerosol can.

-Ian
 
I would return everything for a full refund. The only reason to pay retail is for great service and a machine that does not have issues.

4 house calls costs them more than a DK board. This whole thing doesn't make a lot of sense. I would avoid them.
 
I agree, get a full refund and find one that works, maybe from a member here that is relitively close.
Sounds like they are just flipping games to me. Not cool for a retail swhop to be doing as they would go out of business pretty quick dealing with all the issues.

That being said I assume this is the 4 board set with twice the ribbon cables which can be problematic and should have been replaced.

I would return everything for a full refund. The only reason to pay retail is for great service and a machine that does not have issues.

4 house calls costs them more than a DK board. This whole thing doesn't make a lot of sense. I would avoid them.
 
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