op amps on invaders clone

nick66

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hi, i own a 'Space Stranger (1978 Yachiyo Electronics)' which is a b/w space invader clone. problem is i have 3 sounds missing, saucer hit, hit and fire. this is a very early clone and i suspect directly copied from the taito board. i am guessing the op amps are Lm3900's but all ID on all ic's have been removed. piggybacking one of the op amps with an lm3900n brought back the fire sound (kind of). does anyone have any knowledge on this board? i am tempted to just put in new lm3900n chips but i really don't want to screw the board up.

thanks, nick.
 
Not me, but here are some links that may help you. One guy on a youtube video mentioned that he found a schematic somewhere, so that might help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47TWcvuj3rQ

http://www.arcade-museum.com/members/member_detail.php?member_id=418756

Read the comments on the YouTube video about the schematic. As I understand it, Space Stranger 2 is just a color version of Space Stranger. That seems to imply that the sound sections for both games might be the same. So, that is potentially another lead.
 
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There was a guy over on the dragonslairfans forum that had a Taito cocktail that was missing the fire and base explosion sounds, and replacing the LM3900 fixed the shot sound (he thought it might be a bad pot on the other).
 
hi thanks, i have been trying to contact the youtube guy for a while now. that schematic turned out to be just the inside door info for dip settings. a shame Yachiyo went to so much trouble to blank all the IC's. They must have cloned this game in a hurry and my guess is they would have gone like for like and not taken time to try 'options'. i am going to replace a known good op amp with a LM3900....see what happens. i will post the result.
 
I'm the biggest n00b but I try...

To be honest, this is one of my first cabs and I'm really not an electronics genuis -- but I do know just enough to get myself into trouble..

Anyhow, If you need me to take some pics of my board or name off any parts inside of there, I will be more than happy to help you out any way I can. Maybe I can learn something...

Checking out the schematic for SI or SID board does seem like a good next step though (if there's nothing that I can do to help) because they are so similiar. It seems that awhile back, I was checking out a .pdf of the service manual for my old, junky SID cab and I'm pretty sure that everything was laid out pretty well in there for the sound. Here's a link to all the service manuals for SI. They have the most complete collection of info on everything SI that I have seen:

http://www.brentradio.com/SpaceInvaders.htm

Since I'm here, I may as well as you something too ;) ...

(It's worth a shot) Do you (or anyone else) have ANY IDEA AT ALL if there is any possible way to obtain the 2 -- first & second player buttons for the front (or a suitable replacement)? Like any Japanese arcade parts that are 30+ years old, they're kind of hard to track down. I've literally searched the interwebs high and low for a replacement and I don't even know where to begin. If someone could point me in the right direction, that would be great (but I don't expect miracles).

I figure that since you probably have the part right there, and since you seem to have more experience with cabs than I do, you may have better luck finding a match than me?
 
Hi and good to hear from a fellow space stranger owner!

regarding the buttons, mine is an early b/w cocktail and the buttons are not 'arcade' buttons. they look to be standard but large 'push to make' component buttons with a locking bezel on the outside (pics to follow). i am sure they are original and will get some pics up soon. i am sure i can track similar buttons down in the UK and can ship them to you if suitable.

did yachiyo leave the part numbers on your IC's? if so do you have the 7 op amp numbers for the top board?

best regards, nick
 
Work in progress...

Cheers Nick!

Thanks for your offer to help me out with my buttons. After looking at your pics though, I noticed that the buttons are completely different :( Mine has/had the 2 square buttons and yours has the little round red ones. Our two cabs are completely different but I think the boards are the same... Yours is much nicer looking than mine btw (although the top on mine would look nice in my bathroom).

Now as for those pesky IC's...

I want to make sure that the ones you're looking for are in the right location on the board so I don't give you any wrong numbers. Few of them have any markings on them at all.

In location 19, there IS one which reads "LM3900n". That is 1 of 2 on the main board that has any ledgible markings left on it.

In location 1, the IC is marked: /905LM380N

So, if the one you're looking for isn't in location 1 or 19... then it's going to be blank or unreadable... at least on my board.

Now, I've also noticed that if you look really, REALLY close, all the ICs have different shapes stamped into them (a dot in the bottom left, 2 dots, or an oval shape with 1 dot). I found one burried down on the video board that has the same dot pattern (the oval shaped one with the one dot) as the one in location 7. It reads: 5N74367AN (I think) and is a Texas Instruments part. Since they have the same dot pattern, maybe they are the same?

Let me know if that helped. If not, I'll be glad to go in there and check out any other locations on the board for you.

-Beau
 
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Many Thanks Beau, just to know Yuchiyo used the Lm900's is a step forward. How are you numbering the components ie. postition 1, 19..?

I sent more details via email as i cant seem to post pics in the threads here. a pity as this could be helpful to others.

sorry i couldnt be more help with the buttons, are standard 32mm square buttons not suitable? looks like Yachiyo were in a big hurry turn these machines out.
i remember when my local arcade had invaders....and ONLY invaders for a while...and a queue to play. they couldnt get enough to go round...hence the clones....BIG money to be made by the manufacturers and operators back in the day!
 
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How goes it Nick?

I got your pics and now we may be getting somewhere. If you look really close on your board, next to each IC, there should be a little, TINY number printed. Most likely it's buried under some dust so you may need to dust it off with a Q-tip. The numbers printed on the board should corrospond to the written schematic (wouldn't it be nice to have one of those!).

So, it turns out that the ones you had labled 1-6 would actually be 19-24 (1=19, 2=20 etc.) And, as luck turns out, the first problem IC (the one that you labled as #1) was the one that was clearly marked "LM3900m". So now we KNOW that the one in location 19 IS IN FACT the LM3900m.

As for the other problem ICs...

After looking at the "dot pattern" stamped into each IC, it looks to me like all of the ones that you are having problems with are the LM3900m... at least it LOOKS that way. Now if we knew for SURE that different ICs have different "dot patterns" then we would know for sure.

Pics posted below, left to right:

Super Space Stranger board, SS1 cocktail, SS1 screen, SS1 CP, SS1 Flyer
 

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Since I managed to get some pics up, I've uploaded a pic of my Mark Stranger 2 board in case we need to compare the two. I've rotated it so the top is where the "top" of the board would be when you go to read the numbers printed on the board. If you click on the picture a few time it will make it larger.

Pics posted below, left to right:

Mark Space Stranger 2 board, SS2 Cocktail, SS2 Screen, SS2 CP
 

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real progress at last....at least regarding the op amps. many many thanks. i have ordered brand new LM3900's and will let you know how the repair goes. while i am at it i will do a basic drawing of the board and mark all known IC's. i will try to post something that can be added to in the future and hopefully end up with a complete chip listing for the board. would really like to know the position of the 74174s mentioned in pcjohn's thread.

as for the cabinet, only the top and side instructions seem to differ, legs, cashbox etc. are all the same.

can somebody please please point me to the part that shows how to post pics on this forum...spacedinvader had to post mine for me!
 
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Lookie what I found...

As it turns out, I found this a few months ago and cheaped out on it. Since mine already worked, I figured, "I'll never need that". DUHHH! I almost completely forgot about it...

AN ORIGINAL MARK STRANGER 2 INSTRUCTION MANUAL!

Just purchased and in transit to my house now! ;)

When I get it, I'm going to scan each page so that we can all have a look at the schematic. I just hope everything isn't printed in Japanese...

Now, as far as how to post pics:

On the bottom right hit the "go advanced" button. Then hit the "manage attachments" button. Then "browse" & "upload". If all is working, then you should be able to upload. On my main PC, I had problems at first but thats how it works in theory.

Hope that helps.
 

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OMG....... How cool is that? Dont worry if it is in Japanese....I have a friend who will translate.
The LM3900's arrived this morning but due to last nights work christmas party i will not be attempting any electrical work today!
thanks to those who helped me out re. posting pics.

Nick.
 
OK....clear head and here we go!

i changed LM3900's at position 19 & 20...result all sound lost except 'fire'
left 21 for time being due to old repair to trace's
changed 22, 23, 24....yippeee....6 out of 7 sounds..and in the right places! only 'saucer hit' missing.
checked 21...looks hooked up OK so changed the IC.....still no 'saucer hit' but a faint trace of noise (hiss) might have been there before...not sure.
a little more chasing to do... oh for a schematic!

Nick.
 
The long awaited Space Stranger Instruction Manual !!!

I went out to the mailbox today and there it was, an original Space Stranger Instruction manual with all of the schmetics & goodies. What is almost as cool is the guy sent me not only one but TWO copies and FIVE DIP switch sheets which are all written in ENGLISH! Whew WHO! Lemme know if you want the other one Nick, as I'll gladly mail it to you.

So, I've been scanning & editing the pages for a while now and I fineally have a usable .zip file put together. I wanted to put everything into a .pdf but that's still a work in progress.

So I guess I can only put the first 2 pages up... Well here's the DIP setting, wiring diagram and and Edge connector chart as a teaser...

I went and uploaded the rest at photobucket until I can figure out how to put it into a better file.

http://photobucket.com/SpaceStrangerManual

The writing is really, really small and there are a few really smudged out numbers but it's basically all there. These need to be read in really hi-rez to make everything out.
 

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I THINK YOU HAVE THE HOLY GRAIL BEAU!

.....seems like the answer to my problem lies on page 6 in the photobucket images...and guess what....cant quite make it out!

I would be honoured to have a copy, a photostat would be fine if you didn't want to part with the manuals you tracked down. i will gladly cover cost via paypal or other. let me know via email.
when i bought the cocktail i had planned to put an emulator in.... but it is sooo close to being FWO there is no way that will happen now. Do we know how many of these are still operational? not too many left i think.

cab restoration takes place over the christmas holidays....then just that pesky saucer hit to work out!...i hope to get some youtube footage up soon.

thanks again, nick.
 
The original pics that I had scanned are about twice as large. They're big enough so you can zoom in and get a close enough look to read everything. The problem is that I can't find a place to upload them. I tried to send them to you as individual .jpegs and also as a .zip but the files are too large and it won't let me. Every place I've tried to upload the full, hi-rez pics ends up shrinking them down. Any suggestions?

And -- there was also a time for me when I considered throwing a 60-in-1 into mine... I'm really, really glad I didn't... I like Space Stranger as much if not more than the original Space Invaders now. I think that the few little things like a free play at 3000, the UFO changing directions and just the feel of it, adds just enough to make it more interesting without completely changing it (like Space Invaders Deluxe did). And, the fact that I am one of the few people left in the world who gets to play it... that's the deal breaker for me ;). Although my next project is going to be a multigame on a junker cab, I feel a lot better destroying something like an old Golden Tee than something that I actually like to play.

I just put together a Space Stranger blog and when I get the technical difficulties sorted out with the instruction manual, I wan't to put up a link to it there. I thought it would be cool to have a little page on the web with as much info on Space Stranger as possible. Maybe it will help us Space Stranger owners locate parts or info or at the very least, save a few of these from the junk pile.

http://spacestrangerarcade.blogspot.com/
 
Its that op amp at pos. 21 that eludes me..... with the old repair... i need to confirm its hooked up correct and then move on throught that circuit. fault could well be elsewhere or maybe even the odd pin to ground as i am getting some hiss. how does the saucer hit sound compare to taito/midway......same 'whoop whoop whoop' etc?

thanks again for all your help Beau and will send email re. the manual over the weekend.

have a good one, Nick.
 
A new wrinkle...

So for whatever reason, I went into the archive of space stranger owners (all 4 or 5 of them) and decided to shoot them each an email telling them that I had the intruction manual and they could download it if they needed it. I just get an email back and attached is A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT INSTURCTION MANUAL. This one has a much clearer list of the ROMS and the noises they make (like the flying saucer hit)...
 

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