my cnc troubles continue and a note for my customers!

DPtwiz

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my cnc troubles continue and a note for my customers!

Firstly, thanks a TON to those who have pending orders with me, your patience is greatly appreciated! Roadrunner000, Cnlmoore, Seawolf, JoeMagiera, P1001, and anyone else i am forgetting!

I purchased a 2500.00 High frequency spindle for my cnc, which should have made my productivity go through the roof. It should have taken my cut time from 30 - 40 minutes a sheet, down to 7 minutes. But, unfortunately, all it's given me is a complete F*@&ing headache and a machine i can't even use.

I have emailed and called the manufacturer www.shopbottools.com almost daily for the last 3 weeks, trying everything under the sun to figure out what's wrong with the damn thing. Here's what it did initially after installation. It would plunge in the bit, and start to cut, but move really slow, and make a nasty chatter sound, and it wasn't cutting the correct shape/distance, and cut jibberish. It was supposed to cut a square, i get a bow tie shape.

With some really good troubleshooting help from Dave at ram controls, (4 solid hours on the phone) it looks like the problem has been narrowed down. The spindle has a max RPM of 18000 at 2.2 HP constant. it is NOT making the correct rpm, it's substantially less than 18K when set to max. Dave helped me eliminate electrical noise/interference by testing all the variables, running a preset cut file each time. If we removed the cutting bit, and ran the file, i could visually see the machine was making the correct movements. only under load, cutting, did it screw up.

Our test that really proved it, is i went in and made a bit profile, and slowed the machine movement speed down to 1" a second, and set the spindle RPM to max, and it cut just fine.

I should be able to cut 3/4" inch deep in a single pass, at 5 inches per second. So something in the spindle/spindle controller is wired wrong from the factory, it's defective, or they sent me the wrong one for my make/model of machine. I'll be in contact with them tomorrow on the phone to see what's next. I already emailed them all my testing info to PROVE thier spindle is the problem, which they have never even considered.

Dave and I went over my breaker box, wiring, and junction box, verified it was at 220 with my meter, and any other things it could be. only thing i wired in was the main power to it, and the cable that runs from control box to spindle, and it only goes on one way.

Sorry if this long and boring, but i know the guys who have ordered from me need to know what the hold up is! Again, thanks for your patience, and huge thanks to dave for figuring this out when the people who made it couldn't!! I'll update this thread as soon as i know what the hell is going on, and when i might be up and running again. Also, thanks to everyone who has Pm'ed me for cabs/parts, i just can't take any more orders until i fulfill the current orders! Brett
 
I was thinking of purchasing one myself. Let me know how they treat you and how things turn out for you.
Id love to see some finished stuff when you get that far.

What have you made so far with it? before the problems?
 
i've made over 100 arcade cabs with it so far.. galaga, starwars cockpit, ms pac, ms pac cocktail, dragon's lair, Q*bert, nintendo cabs, all kinds of stuff. Here's todays update... i call them when i get home from work, 5 minutes before they close, and get thier tech on the phone. He asks me if i have my spindle control box setup sheet. i said yeah i have the instructions right here.. he says no, it's a single page with parameters. NO i don't have it, it's not in the envelope with the instructions. Let alone they sent me the WRONG instructions for a different model of machine and had to email them to me.

I tell him i am sitting in front of the controller, just walk me through it. He says i'll email them to you, put them all in, and let me know if that fixes it.. and then says, "ok then, thanks" what a miserable prick. rushed me off the phone and hung up. SO, the controller box needs about 60 parameters set in it, and all mine were wrong. The other tech told me 3 weeks ago they set all that shit in the factory. WRONG! so, i get it all programmed in, and set it back to Frequency, and now the spindle itself will not turn on. Fucking great. I went back through all the parameters and i have everything set correctly. Also, my Frequency has a range of 0.0 to 18.0 now it reads from 0.0 to 300.00 and it won't turn on.

And of course, they are closed now. So i emailed them, and i get to sit around with my thumb up my ass till they reply so i can try to test cut something. I will never ever buy another thing from these idiots ever again. I am sooo sick of this shit, i think i'm gonna finish my orders once it's running correctly, and sell the fucking thing.
 
Ive had a few problems with big purchases like that regarding equipment in my industry and the only thing I can tell you is that you have to have patience. Its wrong how they put you off but if you call them several times you will get dealt with.
Accept that there will be no quick answers and that they will probably be on and off the phone with you at least a few more times to get everything running correctly.
I have heard from a few owners that once you get everything set up correctly things are pretty smooth.
When you get angry you only end up wearing your self out.
Try to save your energy for the phone call your about to make and just keep pressing them to give you assistance. Insist that they stay on the phone until the machine is running and have them walk you through it.

Potential customers are paying attention to how they deal with you on your deal.
(remind them of this)


Sorry you are having to go through that and all the run around but you
will get through it.
Best Regards,

Justin
 
i've made over 100 arcade cabs with it so far.. galaga, starwars cockpit, ms pac, ms pac cocktail, dragon's lair, Q*bert, nintendo cabs, all kinds of stuff. Here's todays update... i call them when i get home from work, 5 minutes before they close, and get thier tech on the phone. He asks me if i have my spindle control box setup sheet. i said yeah i have the instructions right here.. he says no, it's a single page with parameters. NO i don't have it, it's not in the envelope with the instructions. Let alone they sent me the WRONG instructions for a different model of machine and had to email them to me.

I tell him i am sitting in front of the controller, just walk me through it. He says i'll email them to you, put them all in, and let me know if that fixes it.. and then says, "ok then, thanks" what a miserable prick. rushed me off the phone and hung up. SO, the controller box needs about 60 parameters set in it, and all mine were wrong. The other tech told me 3 weeks ago they set all that shit in the factory. WRONG! so, i get it all programmed in, and set it back to Frequency, and now the spindle itself will not turn on. Fucking great. I went back through all the parameters and i have everything set correctly. Also, my Frequency has a range of 0.0 to 18.0 now it reads from 0.0 to 300.00 and it won't turn on.

And of course, they are closed now. So i emailed them, and i get to sit around with my thumb up my ass till they reply so i can try to test cut something. I will never ever buy another thing from these idiots ever again. I am sooo sick of this shit, i think i'm gonna finish my orders once it's running correctly, and sell the fucking thing.

NOT good service, but you can't get TOO mad at the guy for wanting to leave at the end of the day, and not wanting to spend the next who knows how long walking you through entering 60 parameters. YOU know you can follow instructions and do it quickly, but he doesn't.

The problem is that they shouldn't be closing their customer service anything like early - ShopBot sells to a lot of smaller guys, many of whom are gonna have day jobs and not be able to call until the evening, and it's not really OK to leave all those customers hanging, waiting on e-mails.
 
Sorry if this long and boring, but i know the guys who have ordered from me need to know what the hold up is! Again, thanks for your patience, and huge thanks to dave for figuring this out when the people who made it couldn't!! I'll update this thread as soon as i know what the hell is going on, and when i might be up and running again. Also, thanks to everyone who has Pm'ed me for cabs/parts, i just can't take any more orders until i fulfill the current orders! Brett

This is anything but boring. This is exactly the kind of info that gives people confidence in a seller when there are delays.
 
Brett,
you bought just the spindle or a whole CNC machine?
I used to work on industrial CNC routers with spindle speeds of 80,000-120,000+ RPM. Pluritec, Hitachi, Excellon, Dynamotion etc... (circuit board routers and drillers) The problem sounds like really bad runout or a collet issue but I'm sure you've already checked that stuff. It could definitely also be your parameters/controller settings as the high freq/speed spindle drives can be really picky. I'm sure they will work out the issue, it's most likely a bad value in your setup somewhere.
 
well, the setting parameters only took 5 minutes, it was pretty easy. They have after hours tech support through email, but it takes 2 - 3 hours to get a reply. Then once you go try what they suggest in that email, you email em back, and they might answer you back in another 2 -3 hours, so you only get 2 emails answered a night at best.

Made some progress, they had me check the concentric bearings on the Y axis, and they were a little tight. I made some adjustments to them, now when i run it it is cutting the correct shapes, but not perfect. On a square, the sides all bow in towards to center, and i cut a circle, and it's not perfectly round, it has a few oblong spots in it. Also, once it finished cutting and returned to 0,0 home position, and stopped, the Y axis was off 1" from where it started.

I emailed them at 11pm, but too late to get a reply.
 
i've made over 100 arcade cabs with it so far.. galaga, starwars cockpit, ms pac, ms pac cocktail, dragon's lair, Q*bert, nintendo cabs, all kinds of stuff. Here's todays update... i call them when i get home from work, 5 minutes before they close, and get thier tech on the phone. He asks me if i have my spindle control box setup sheet. i said yeah i have the instructions right here.. he says no, it's a single page with parameters. NO i don't have it, it's not in the envelope with the instructions. Let alone they sent me the WRONG instructions for a different model of machine and had to email them to me.

I tell him i am sitting in front of the controller, just walk me through it. He says i'll email them to you, put them all in, and let me know if that fixes it.. and then says, "ok then, thanks" what a miserable prick. rushed me off the phone and hung up. SO, the controller box needs about 60 parameters set in it, and all mine were wrong. The other tech told me 3 weeks ago they set all that shit in the factory. WRONG! so, i get it all programmed in, and set it back to Frequency, and now the spindle itself will not turn on. Fucking great. I went back through all the parameters and i have everything set correctly. Also, my Frequency has a range of 0.0 to 18.0 now it reads from 0.0 to 300.00 and it won't turn on.

And of course, they are closed now. So i emailed them, and i get to sit around with my thumb up my ass till they reply so i can try to test cut something. I will never ever buy another thing from these idiots ever again. I am sooo sick of this shit, i think i'm gonna finish my orders once it's running correctly, and sell the fucking thing.

Brett-

Have you looked for CNC forums?

As with KLOV, I would imagine more people in any forum know more than the people who sell/manufacturer stuff.

And, it's not boring to me. It really makes me not want to get a CNC machine and happy that there are people out there, like you, that take this stuff on.

Good luck today.
-Tim
 
While I'm not really a potential customer, I will say that taking the time to post this was a good idea. It shows the customer that you care. If some of those other vendors around here were a little more forthcoming and open about this, it would save them a lot of headache. 5 minutes to make a post, saves countless hours in damage control and keeps your customers returning.
 
You know what, we all have things going on and things come up. The fact that you had enough respect to just keep in touch and update your customers on the status says a lot.
 
my cnc troubles continue and a note for my customers!

I would be interested in these if the shipping was'nt soo darn much. Is there a way they can be shipped like kits we build?
 
i appear to be back in business!! I have worked on this all day, and 8 phone calls to the manufacturer. It was a large list of things wrong. Some of the problems were there since day 1, but not evident due to running the machine below it's potential, and some of it was on thier end. the spindle control box comes factory programmed, i went in and manually reprogrammed all the parameters, and it ran much, much faster. Some of the other things found, loose gecko motor driver from the factory, my Y axis and Z axis concentric bearings were off, the Y was too tight, the Z was to loose. And finally, i found i could not use a 1/4 bit to cut 3/4 deep in one pass, i was getting a ton of bit deflection. Overall, i think it's ready to use and will be attempting to cut full sheets tomorrow and hopefully start to get caught back up!
 
ahh success!! I just cut out the other two sheets to roadruner000's Agent X cab, and they turned out perfect!! Back in business!
 
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