Mismatched sprites/images on Crystal Castles

turtlespin

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Hello All! I purchased a refurbished Crystal Castles (the 1983 Atari game).

I played it just a couple of times, and now the sprites are all messed up. For example, Bentley Bear (main character) gets replaced by an image of the witch, and then a tree, etc. Partials of other sprites appear over enemies (for example pairs of Bently's feet appearing over each Crystal Ball enemy). I've tried unplugging and plugging back in. I've tried entering the test mode (it encountered no errors). I've unplugged and plugged back in the circuit board, and I've also removed the board and pushed on each of the chips to make sure they're all fully in. nearly all are soldered, the few that are not all seem to be firmly in.

I'm very upset because this was my first Arcade Machine purchase, and it's starting to feel like I was sold a lemon since I only played it twice. Can anyone offer any guidance on what's wrong or how I might fix it? I'm an engineer so I'm very prepared to solder/rewire etc. I've searched the forum for a similar issue, and I've also looked at the guide on PCB. but curious if anyone has encountered something similar.
 

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I would not feel ripped off, if it was working when it was sold that's all you can ask, these things are old and if you are into arcades you'll expect them to fail. I eventually though myself how to fix them so I didn't not have to hoarde working parts anymore and most collectors learn to be handy with fixing to some degree during the process.
I've had games I bought work when I picked them up and got them home dead (usually that's something simple though)

Check the common problems first starting with power if you detemine it is the pcb (most likely it is if not power issues) a few people here on Klov fix these boards, myself included.
 
I would contact the person you bought it from. If it was sold as refurbished, they may stand behind it. I warranty all of the boards I restore and sell, but I can't speak for other sellers. However it's not uncommon for a repaired board to fail again shortly after being repaired, especially if the board sat unpowered for a very long time (i.e., years), as the chips on these just don't seem to like sitting for really long periods. I see this fairly regularly on the boards I refurb, which is why I burn-in test them for at least several days, with multiple power cycles, and I warranty them.

But if the seller was someone on this forum, most if not all of the guys I know here that do repairs are stand-up guys, and may help you out.

Also, here's a thread with a similar issue, though I'm not sure if it's the same one you're seeing, if your sprites are actually incorrect, and not just corrupted, which might imply a different issue:

http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=105914
 
@brzezicki how much does something like that typically cost (for your or others)? (I live in Boston, so it would be to come over, diagnose, and fix the problem). Super ballpark, as I'm just trying to determine if it's worth me trying to have it fixed, vs just attempting to return it.
 
Hello All! I purchased a refurbished Crystal Castles (the 1983 Atari game).

I played it just a couple of times, and now the sprites are all messed up. For example, Bentley Bear (main character) gets replaced by an image of the witch, and then a tree, etc. Partials of other sprites appear over enemies (for example pairs of Bently's feet appearing over each Crystal Ball enemy). I've tried unplugging and plugging back in. I've tried entering the test mode (it encountered no errors). I've unplugged and plugged back in the circuit board, and I've also removed the board and pushed on each of the chips to make sure they're all fully in. nearly all are soldered, the few that are not all seem to be firmly in.

Replace the sockets on the gfx ROMs, or maybe swap out 7A.

It's something simple in the addressing.
 
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yeah try what HudsonArcade said.

If that doesn't work or you don't feel comfortable doing that (unless your good at soldering and specifically desoldering, I wouldn't try replacing the socket yourself) as it's really easy to mess up the traces such that no one will even attempt to fix your board.

like this
http://www.arcade-cabinets.com/fixes/millipede/pics/35-1-large.jpg (though I did fix that for the customer but almost sent it back)
(no disrespect if you try of course, you have to learn somehow, and I myself totally wasted a few boards when I was learning! :)

I do fix boards.
As off last month my rates is $100 flat labor fee not including whatever needed parts and return shipping are. If it arrives and it's not broken (that is something is wrong with your actual game (power supply, monitor, fuses, cabling etc) there is no charge but return shipping. (in this case it's 99% a board problem unless you just have weird power that just happens to only cause that issue which would be hard to believe, though I'd still check it first if you have a mulitmeter)I
I wouldn't bother hiring a local tech, most (I say "most", I'm sure there's one or two out there especially if someone just happens to be close to you) people that fix boards don't make house calls. If you hire a local "tech" more than likely they'll charge you $100 - $200 to come out and tell you that you need a new board.

For some boards it's much cheaper to find a working one on here or ebay as the cost to fix a board ((time, parts, equipment, shipping both ways) > the cost to just buy a working one).

that said when you buy anything from someone selling, unless you know they stand behind their sale you may end up paying money to have somethign broken or not 100% functional.
 
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Still trucking

It's been a while since I had time to work on this, now I'm back at it trying to fix this game.

I got a multimeter and checked power. It was 4.71 at the front of the board and 4.68 at the back. I cleaned the part where the power sections click on, and now it's up to 4.81 across the board!

Unfortunately, that didn't help. I'll keep cleaning and see if I can get it higher/closer to 5. I especially checked the 7A chip. It's getting 4.8 now.

I don't know what else to try, I'll take out and clean the chips that come out though.
 
Power supply

I'm trying to find out the voltage coming out of the power supply, but it's pretty impossible to say. The "power supply" I have doesn't look like anything I can find on the internet. I rubbed some of the dust away to reveal "Serial No URO4905" stuck on the the main box, and the circuit-board-looking piece of the power supply attached to the side of the cabinet. (Photos attached for both).

Anyone have an idea of what my power supply is or how to determine the voltage going to the PCB?

Thanks!
 

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The power supply is the board with the big black heat sink
You can turn up the power with a small plastic pot (knob) on that board but always read the power at the main board as you'll lose some volts in the wiring and connector which is normal
 
Voltage now at 5 across PCB

I've managed the voltage.
I found this great guide for power brick troubleshooting: http://bitslicer.tripod.com/ar_brick_troubleshooting.htm

and then found this: http://www.elektronforge.com/AdjustAtariPS.htm
and adjusted the potentiometer to that the PCB is now sitting at 5.02V at the front and 4.99V at the end.
Chip 7A is getting exactly 5.00V.

Unfortunately, the sprites are jumbled exactly as they were before.

@brzezicki @wugly mentioned that they "saw the big a at bottom but now realize that a is for a board revision. 7 a looks like a 74ls chip" and they think it's a 74ls chip instead of a ROM. They said to get your thoughts.

I know I was told to "replace the sockets on the gfx ROMs" so that's what I'll be googling now. Any insight is appreciated. Thanks!
 
Cleaning the PCB

Since fixing the voltage did not solve the problem, I'm cleaning the ROMs on the PCB. Nothing could get the corrosion off the pins though, (tried: isopropyl alcohol, toothbrush, bar eraser, q-tip). So I'm leaving the chips (pulled out of sockets) with their pins in vinegar over night to see if that helps clean them.

I'll wipe them with isopropyl and a q-tip in 12 hours and report back. If it works with the two I'm trying, then I'll do it with all of them, and then leave everything to dry, and then re-attach the PCB and try/pray.
 
This isn't likely to be an issue with dirty sockets. But you can confirm that by putting the board into test mode. There's a switch inside the door.

Download and read the manual. See the section on the test mode to understand what the test screen tells you. If there are any issues with ROMs or RAM, the self test will tell you on that screen.

Otherwise it's a more involved board issue, and you'll likely need a board repair.
 
Fingers crossed

Oh no, let's hope that's not the case haha. I'm cleaning the chips now.
I searched all over for the manual, is there an archive somewhere?

I believe I tried running in test mode before (there are instructions for it on the back of the panel) and it returned no errors, but I'll clean up the chips and try again. It's been a long time since I tried that test mode.
 
Oh no, let's hope that's not the case haha. I'm cleaning the chips now.
I searched all over for the manual, is there an archive somewhere?

I believe I tried running in test mode before (there are instructions for it on the back of the panel) and it returned no errors, but I'll clean up the chips and try again. It's been a long time since I tried that test mode.


Google 'crystal castles arcade manual'.
 
Bad News

Well, I meticulously cleaned every one of the chips with isopropyl alcohol.

I let the board dry for a day, and then plugged everything back in.

The sprites are still messed up, arguably worse now, and now the sound is messed up too. So, far from fixing anything, it looks like I just made it worse.


This game has gone past what I can do for it. So, I'm going to sell it. If anyone is interested please let me know.
 
FYI, you can buy a refurbished board for it (and/or trade yours in for some credit, if you want). I have one available.

PM for details, if interested.
 
Well, I meticulously cleaned every one of the chips with isopropyl alcohol.



I let the board dry for a day, and then plugged everything back in.



The sprites are still messed up, arguably worse now, and now the sound is messed up too. So, far from fixing anything, it looks like I just made it worse.





This game has gone past what I can do for it. So, I'm going to sell it. If anyone is interested please let me know.


Sorry have not responded to you questions been super busy.
Sorry to hear it's did not work out :(
 
OK, I think I ended up with this game :)
Picked it up at auction in Texas for my wife's Christmas present, worked great during preview but when I got it back to my shop, it started having the errors described. Errors seem to go away the longer the game is on.

As I am not very versed in Atari boards, I'm looking for someone who can go over the board and make sure there are no other issues. Unfortunately my local guy does not work on Atari boards. This is one of my wife's favorite games so it will probably be in my collection for the long term so I want to make sure it is running well.

Thanks for the help!

Scott
 
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