K6100 glitches after partial rebuild

Yup! Reflowed all the header pins.

I don't have an HV probe but will pick one up if I need to. What would I test with it? Do you have a model you suggest? Is a special DMM required?

You can get either, but I prefer the standalone type, like this one:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/302239128981

You may want to try the monitor back in Space Duel just to a) test for environmental factors like nearby EM and b) to make sure your game board is still good.

Speaking of 'a', do you have the cover on the HV cage?
 
I was working on a G08 for my Star Trek a month or two ago and it had wavy lines all over the place. Wasn't as bad as what your video shows on the 6100 but it looked somewhat similar. Turned out my HV was running much too high. With some help from douglasgb, I was able to dial it in and that made the vectors steady.

Interested to see if you have a similar problem.
 
You need an HV probe to properly measure and adjust the HV, which you should do anyway, but you definitely need to do after you do any work on a vector monitor.

You want a Fluke 80k-40. They're anywhere from 50-100 bucks used on ebay, depending on how long you want to wait for a cheap one to pop up. But you can almost always get one Buy It Now for 80-90 bucks.

It works with any standard DMM. The probe is basically a huge resistive divider, and it puts out 1V for every 1000V measured. So, you just need a DMM that can measure 20-25V (or 19.5V, in the case of the 6100), as the proper value is 19.5kV.

You want to use the probe to see what your HV is doing, and if it's adjusted correctly.

Also, what version of the HV board do you have? There should be a big number on it starting with a 'P'. Later versions have an HV shutdown function, and maybe that is kicking in, if you have that version of HV board. Post the number.

-Andy

Tanks for the info! I will look into picking up the Fluke probe.

The HV board version is P316 85X0148E. What test points would I use to see if the proper 19.5kV is being produced? I assume the large pot in the center of the HV board is the adjustment, correct?

Also - yes the HV shield is in place. :)

I have the Space Duel PCB arriving back from repair on Monday - will test the monitor with that in the dedicated cab to see if the behavior persists but I would really like to get it fixed so that it works in any cab I put it in.
 
Tanks for the info! I will look into picking up the Fluke probe.

The HV board version is P316 85X0148E. What test points would I use to see if the proper 19.5kV is being produced? I assume the large pot in the center of the HV board is the adjustment, correct?

Also - yes the HV shield is in place. :)

I have the Space Duel PCB arriving back from repair on Monday - will test the monitor with that in the dedicated cab to see if the behavior persists but I would really like to get it fixed so that it works in any cab I put it in.


Ok, the P316 is the more common HV board, and doesn't have the HV cutoff circuit, so that rules that out. Your HV might still be off though, or be cutting out due to some other issue with the HV board.

To measure HV, you take the HV probe, clip the probe's ground clip to the monitor frame, stick the probe under the suction cup that goes into the tube (which contains the anode, i.e., the metal clip that connects to the tube), connect the probe to the DMM, THEN turn on the monitor.

(Note you do NOT want to stick the probe under the cup while the monitor is already on, in the event that the anode pops off (which can happen), in which case you don't want it flopping around with 20,000 volts on it, while you try to kill the power, and not get hit by it). :)
 
Ok, the P316 is the more common HV board, and doesn't have the HV cutoff circuit, so that rules that out. Your HV might still be off though, or be cutting out due to some other issue with the HV board.

To measure HV, you take the HV probe, clip the probe's ground clip to the monitor frame, stick the probe under the suction cup that goes into the tube (which contains the anode, i.e., the metal clip that connects to the tube), connect the probe to the DMM, THEN turn on the monitor.

(Note you do NOT want to stick the probe under the cup while the monitor is already on, in the event that the anode pops off (which can happen), in which case you don't want it flopping around with 20,000 volts on it, while you try to kill the power, and not get hit by it). :)

Thanks! Seems easy enough. I have a lead on a probe and will report back. Silly question - the 19.5kV is DC right?
 
Thanks! Seems easy enough. I have a lead on a probe and will report back. Silly question - the 19.5kV is DC right?
Keep in mind, if the monitor has been off for a while, then the HV will naturally rise a little as the monitor warms-up.

Scott C.
 
Keep in mind, if the monitor has been off for a while, then the HV will naturally rise a little as the monitor warms-up.

Scott C.

Thanks! Was able to find an HV probe - waiting for it to arrive.

In the meantime, wondering if maybe this might be a LV power issue? What test points would I use to test the +/- 26v outputs? Wondering if maybe an LV-2K upgrade might be in order.
 
You want to do an LV2000 upgrade regardless if your LV section is working or not. If the LV section is not already bad, it will be, and will cause other damage.

www.vector-repair.com

Cool, thanks.. will pick one up. Any idea if there is a big difference between this one and the one Arcade Shop sells? Only reason I ask is that I need to order a AVG PCB from them and wouldn't mind saving on shipping - and it looks like their design avoids the power wires.
 
The one AS has pictured is an older revision. I would be surprised if that's the one they actually ship. It's probably just an old pic. The new one is more compact, and has the wires. You have to solder it in either way.
 
Glad to hear you're replacing the LV section as it's the single biggest failure point on K6100 monitors. It's not a matter of if, but when.

I installed the following design from AS over a year ago and it was an easy install. Of course, more recently I've been installing the true LV2K and LV2K Lite, which are equally easy to install despite the two wires.

http://4imgs.com/1103/sys/prod/978_2_0_0.JPG

Scott C.
 
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Glad to hear you're replacing the LV section as it's the single biggest failure point on K6100 monitors. It's not a matter of if, but when.

I installed the following design from AS over a year ago and it was an easy install. Of course, more recently I've been installing the true LV2K and LV2K Lite, which are equally easy to install despite the two wires.

http://4imgs.com/1103/sys/prod/978_2_0_0.JPG

Scott C.

Thanks! Is there any downside to going with the LV2K Lite? I like that I don't need to adjust voltages on the Lite model - if voltage adjustment is not required why would anybody go with the LV2K?
 
Thanks! Is there any downside to going with the LV2K Lite? I like that I don't need to adjust voltages on the Lite model - if voltage adjustment is not required why would anybody go with the LV2K?



There is no drawback. The adjustable one came first, so I think he just kept making them, but there's no real benefit over the lite.

I've used the lites. Fewer parts to break, and easier to install with no adjustment.

Note also there is also the LV6100 from Mark Spaeth/Cambridge Arcade. I think these are actually a little better, as they are made with all off-the-shelf through-hole parts. So they are easier to repair, if you do manage to blow one.

http://cambridgearcade.dyndns.org/?q=node/18

(And note his new boards actually don't have the postage-stamp look of the older one shown. They have straight edges, like the LV2000's).

PM Mark directly if you want one (HudsonArcade), as I believe the cart on the site doesn't work.
 
Here is another video of it connected to the Space Duel in the white diagonal grid test screen. Not sure it's an HV issue.. gives a much better look at the problem. Seem like deflection but I really have no idea what I am talking about. :)

Any more suggestions?

Thanks guys - this one is really kicking my butt.. and it needs to be re-converged on top of it all but the rings are thin plastic and don't easily move. Grr.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfwt3vkNrp8
 
It's a problem with the positive voltage only

Imagine the screen as 4 boxes stacked 2 x 2

xy-posneg.jpg


If you look at your games problem, all the problem quarters contain a positive

So it's likely you have a problem on one of the positive pins on your headers

There are 4 or 5 headers on that deflection board, but since your problem is on both the X & Y axis it pretty much narrows the problem down to the connector P100

I suggest getting a buzzer (on your DMM) onto your deflection board and find the microscopic crack

These are common where the thin tracks join the header pads

They are hard to see as they are in a corner, like a shadow, so you may need a light and magnifier.

The buzzer will find it if you wiggle the header

NOTE: the headers should not move, if they do then the tracks become like a hinge, hence they break

Good luck.
 
It's a problem with the positive voltage only

Imagine the screen as 4 boxes stacked 2 x 2

xy-posneg.jpg


If you look at your games problem, all the problem quarters contain a positive

So it's likely you have a problem on one of the positive pins on your headers

There are 4 or 5 headers on that deflection board, but since your problem is on both the X & Y axis it pretty much narrows the problem down to the connector P100

I suggest getting a buzzer (on your DMM) onto your deflection board and find the microscopic crack

These are common where the thin tracks join the header pads

They are hard to see as they are in a corner, like a shadow, so you may need a light and magnifier.

The buzzer will find it if you wiggle the header

NOTE: the headers should not move, if they do then the tracks become like a hinge, hence they break

Good luck.

Thanks for the detailed reply Dez.. really appreciate it! I already reflowed all the header pins but i'll take it apart again now to see if I missed something or if the connector is somehow damaged.
 
This is what you are looking at


These are approximations

All the best

Turns out I put Q100 in backwards. Oops! The glitches are solved (yay!) but now I have a pulsing issue (video below). It's not HV related (swapped in a known working HV cage from another WG6100 and same behavior).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVirwGLhuK4

Header at P100 (and all headers) have been reflowed - pins and red connector on P100 look to be in good shape. I also re-soldered all the wires that directly connect to the deflection PCB. No change.

Any suggestions?
 
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