Joust won't boot up... Where do I start?

[Jakobud]

Ah I think I found it later in the schematic in a table:

F1 = 1A, SB 250V
F2 = 7A, SB 250V
F3 = 4A, SB 250V
F4 & F5 = 7A SB

I'm still a little bit confused though if you compare this to my fuse labels... I have 4 250V fuses and one 125V fuse...

Sorry if I'm missing something obvious here.

 

[YellowDog]

The fuses are labeled on the power supply board.

Starting from the fuse nearest the big capacitor (the big grey tubular object on the power supply board):

F1 - 1A Slow Blow
F2 - 5A Slow Blow
F3 - 4A Slow Blow
F4 - 7A Slow Blow
F5 - 7A Slow Blow

When the power supply board is mounted correctly this is the order from top to bottom.

Most fuses are rated at 250V but occasionally you run into 125V or even 32V ratings.

I would throw all of those current fuses away and go to Radio Shack for fresh fuses. Make sure you pick up slow blow. They are usually 4 for $3 so for $12 you get piece of mind that you have the right fuses and they are fresh.

Since I don't think anybody answered your other question, the tree boards on the main mounting plate are:
- the CPU (or MPU) board. The large board with all the chips
- the ROM board the board with the Red labeled chips to the right of the MPU board.
- the I/O board is the small board below the ROM board
- the power supply board is the board at the bottom of the other mounting plate. It has the big heat sink attached to it.
- the sound board is the board above the power supply board.

I do Williams board repairs as well as selling rebuilt boards, including power supply boards. PM me for details. I do board swaps as well (you send broken board + cash, I send you a working board). Unless all the boards have the same serial number (don't break up a set unless you have to) a board swap is the cheapest solution.

ken

 

[Dokert]

Ah I think I found it later in the schematic in a table:

F1 = 1A, SB 250V
F2 = 5A, SB 250V
F3 = 4A, SB 250V
F4 & F5 = 7A SB

I'm still a little bit confused though if you compare this to my fuse labels... I have 4 250V fuses and one 125V fuse...

Sorry if I'm missing something obvious here.

Don't sweat the voltage, the amperage is important.

 

[Jakobud]

Ah ya the PDF was kinda hard to read. It does look like 5A now that I look closer.

Okay so if I went to RadioShack and got the following fuses:

1A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
5A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
4A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
7A Slow Blow 250V x2 Radio Shack Link

That would work?

And Yellowdog, I will probably be getting ahold of you soon about a board replacement after I try replacing these fuses.

 

[YellowDog]

I hear you about the PDF's. I have have a back burner project to redraw some of the schematics, just because some are hacked into pieces and it make it a bitch to follow. I have a nearly complete set of manuals for the Williams games at home, but I often try to answer questions at work and the PDF's are all I have.

The fuses from Radio Shack are perfect for this. You may need to raid a couple of them because they are not very good about keeping their parts stocked.

Just PM me about replacement boards. I just got a bunch in, including this beauty:

Most are in much better shape. They actually clean up and work fine with a little work.

ken

 

[Scucci]

I hear you about the PDF's. I have have a back burner project to redraw some of the schematics, just because some are hacked into pieces and it make it a bitch to follow. I have a nearly complete set of manuals for the Williams games at home, but I often try to answer questions at work and the PDF's are all I have.

The fuses from Radio Shack are perfect for this. You may need to raid a couple of them because they are not very good about keeping their parts stocked.

Just PM me about replacement boards. I just got a bunch in, including this beauty:

Most are in much better shape. They actually clean up and work fine with a little work.

ken

LOL, I love that bridge... guilty doing that myself.

 

[Jakobud]

Okay good news! Replacing the bad fuse was the problem. Boots up now. However the controls aren't working. All the leaf switches and their solder points look good. I follow the wires and they hook into the control board fine with two harnesses. I notice when I go into the adjustments screen, the cursor goes down the list automatically, changing values as it goes. I know that you use the two joysticks to control this screen so that tells me that something is maybe shorted? Or is my control board bad? Any thoughts?

 

[Arcadenut]

Ah ya the PDF was kinda hard to read. It does look like 5A now that I look closer.

Okay so if I went to RadioShack and got the following fuses:

1A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
5A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
4A Slow Blow 250V Radio Shack Link
7A Slow Blow 250V x2 Radio Shack Link

That would work?

And Yellowdog, I will probably be getting ahold of you soon about a board replacement after I try replacing these fuses.

This is cheaper then Radio Shack (if you order enough of them)...

http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=33

I ordered 60 fuses (10 of each rating 1A - 6A) from them and my total was $25.51 shipped.

 

[YellowDog]

This is cheaper then Radio Shack (if you order enough of them)...

http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=33

I ordered 60 fuses (10 of each rating 1A - 6A) from them and my total was $25.51 shipped.

I agree, I buy a bunch each time I order parts from Ed. But Jakobud wanted to get his machine up quickly and instant gratification wins over shipping delays almost every time.

To get back to J's question. It is probably the I/O board. You can check the ground loop by hooking your continuity meter to the ground pin on the connector and then the use other lead to test the ground path to the buttons. If that all tests out, then you may need to get out the logic probe to trace the I/O card (or ship it out to get it tested/fixed).

If you can get a known good I/O card you can rule the card in or out very quickly.

ken

 

[Jakobud]

First of all, can I use a multimeter as a 'continuity meter'?

Second, let me get this clear, I stick one end of the meter to the ground pin on the I/O board, and the other end I just stick to one of the leaf switches? And what am I looking for? If the board is good, I should expect that leaf switch to activate, correct? If not, that means the board is bad?

Also another thing I noticed: Following all the wires from the control panel, just inside the cabinet there is a harness/molex connector. If I disconnect that (ie. disconnecting the control panel entirely) I still get the same activity (in the diagnostic screen, the cursor moves down the list by itself). Also, the number on the ROM board shows a lowercase 'u' at this point. Normally its just a zero when that harness is connected properly.

EDIT: Nevermind I just realized I could use my multimeter to test for continuity. One question though, when testing for continuity, do I have the game turned on or off?

 

[YellowDog]

Always test for continuity with the game off. In this case, you will should have the I/O connectors off, so there shoul dbe no activity. But better safe than sorry. If you have the original connectors on the I/O cables the metal used to connect the wire sticks up on the top so yuo can make contact there.

I usually start with the ground. I connect to the ground commector wire and then touch the ground side of each of the leaf switches. If there is continuity there, then I pick one switch and connect the meter to the ground wire and then the the return wire to the specific switch and press the button. This should complete the circuit. If it doesn't then I look for continuity to the return wire side of the switch. I also test the switch itself. It is unlikely that all the switches are bad, but it has happened before.

If the switches check out. Then it is likely to be in the I/O card. Make sure the ribbon cable is connected correctly. It is possible to plug it in so that only one row is plugged in. That will mess things up.

ken

 

[Jakobud]

Little progress update:

I followed your instructions to test for continuity in all the control panel wires. I was a little bit confused by your instructions but this is what I did:

1. Touch multimeter to ground wire on the wire harness that connects to the I/O card (the harness was disconnected at the time). And with the other end I touched the ground side of each switch one at a time. My multimeter changed from infinity to almost zero, which means there is continuity, correct? Anyways, all the ground connections on all the switches appeared okay.

2. Next I tested each switch one at a time, but connecting one end of the multi-meter to the ground side of the switch, and the other end to the corresponding colored wire on the harness and then I pressed the button/switch. All the switches seemed to work out fine. The multimeter value changed from infinity to almost zero. One note about this, the values were quite a bit higher in value than when I was testing the ground wires. Not sure why or what that means. From what I understand, any value at all means there is connectivity, right? Does it mean that the switch is dirty where it makes contact or what? In any case, each switch seemed to be fine.

So in the end, all the wires had some sort of continuity.

So what does this mean? That my I/O card is probably bad? Is there some way to test my I/O card using my multi-meter to confirm this or probably not?

Well, Yellowdog, do you sell or repair I/O boards? If not, do you know a good source that repairs or sells them? I found a guy on ebay that will repair for $30 + shipping.

 

[YellowDog]

Little progress update:

I followed your instructions to test for continuity in all the control panel wires. I was a little bit confused by your instructions but this is what I did:

1. Touch multimeter to ground wire on the wire harness that connects to the I/O card (the harness was disconnected at the time). And with the other end I touched the ground side of each switch one at a time. My multimeter changed from infinity to almost zero, which means there is continuity, correct? Anyways, all the ground connections on all the switches appeared okay.

2. Next I tested each switch one at a time, but connecting one end of the multi-meter to the ground side of the switch, and the other end to the corresponding colored wire on the harness and then I pressed the button/switch. All the switches seemed to work out fine. The multimeter value changed from infinity to almost zero. One note about this, the values were quite a bit higher in value than when I was testing the ground wires. Not sure why or what that means. From what I understand, any value at all means there is connectivity, right? Does it mean that the switch is dirty where it makes contact or what? In any case, each switch seemed to be fine.

So in the end, all the wires had some sort of continuity.

So what does this mean? That my I/O card is probably bad? Is there some way to test my I/O card using my multi-meter to confirm this or probably not?

Well, Yellowdog, do you sell or repair I/O boards? If not, do you know a good source that repairs or sells them? I found a guy on ebay that will repair for $30 + shipping.

It sounds like the wiring harness is to the switches is good, so that leave the I/O board as the next most likely problem. I do repair I/O boards for $10 + parts + shipping. If I find that the board is working correctly, you just pay return shipping. Normally I have some spare boards, but right now I am out of working ones. PM for more details.

ken