Gottlieb Mars System 80 Problems- Wumpf CPU and Lighting

VidyaGamez

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Cross-posted from Pinside

Having a couple problems getting my Mars running. One is with the new Wumpf CPU I bought and one is with the lamps on the PF.

I bought a new Ni-Wumpf CPU off Pinside, set it up to work with Mars, but when it tries to start a game it says "Tilt, tilt, tilt", the PF goes dark and it says "Bad one" on the display. I emailed Ni-Wumpf about this, they told me that "Bad one" means something is wrong in association with the slam switch. In switch test, the CPU tells me to clean switch 77 but according to the manual there is no switch 77. Haven't heard anything back from them about this. FB video link of how the game is behaving: https://www.facebook.com/groups/pinballrepair/permalink/4110867172268792/?sfnsn=mo

My other issue is with the lights on the PF. I was initially having problems with lamps being stuck on or not lighting. I've checked all transistors and chips on the original driver board with my multimeter. I then implemented the thunk cure via this method (https://www.flippers.com/gott-system80.html#thunk), but botched it. I ended up cutting away the legs you were only supposed to lift. I was able to (I think) rectify it by soldering cap legs in place of the chip legs. After this implementation of the thunk cure the problems with lighting got worse, so I got rid of it. Now F2 blows semi-regularly and I'm not sure what's causing it. Back to having some lights stuck on, which seem to be random and not associated with just one particular chip.

I've changed the filter cap, did ground mods, replaced BRs, rebuilt/repinned the power supply, repinned the interconnect harness, and repinned a couple connectors on the MPU (I can't remember which)

As always, any help appreciated.
 
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Mars is funny game. Q-Bert the god of War


I know nothing of Got-lib machines but good luck!
Man when I first had the game on in a semi-working state and it randomly talked it scared the shit out of me. I'll post some pics of the machine it's in really good shape overall with the original two piece infinity mirror backglass still in it. Working on a solution to make it more secure so it doesn't suffer the fate of many other Mars backglasses
 
I do know that inner glass is referred to as the million dollar glass because so many of them would fall out when the operator would open the front glass. Make sure those clips secure it.
 
I do know that inner glass is referred to as the million dollar glass because so many of them would fall out when the operator would open the front glass. Make sure those clips secure it.
The clips they used from the factory SUCK I don't know how it passed QA. They got it right with Black Hole and beyond, where it slides in a channel attached to the head door. Going to try to replicate that
 
Seriously keep that backglass far away from the game until you have some other way to mount it.

Regarding the slam switch, on System 80 games it's supposed to be "closed" to work and allow the game to boot. So if the slam switch is open at all the game won't do anything. Some people modify this (as covered in the old Pinrepair guides) to make the switch read as closed at all times.
 
Seriously keep that backglass far away from the game until you have some other way to mount it.

Regarding the slam switch, on System 80 games it's supposed to be "closed" to work and allow the game to boot. So if the slam switch is open at all the game won't do anything. Some people modify this (as covered in the old Pinrepair guides) to make the switch read as closed at all times.
The backglass is on my shelf for the time being.

As for the slam switch, the one on the coin door is disconnected, but according to the Ni-Wumpf website, it's supposed to ignore the slam switch:
  • Slam switch agnostic - stuck switches are ignored
 
That's interesting about the Ni-Wumpf supposedly ignoring the slam switch, but it also sounded like they blamed the slam switch for the problem. Maybe it needs to be connected?

Any possibility you have some bad/worn light sockets, or maybe a cut in the metal braid? I had issues with GI lights not working on an old Mars playfield I had, and found that some of the light sockets were in bad shape.
 
That's interesting about the Ni-Wumpf supposedly ignoring the slam switch, but it also sounded like they blamed the slam switch for the problem. Maybe it needs to be connected?

Any possibility you have some bad/worn light sockets, or maybe a cut in the metal braid? I had issues with GI lights not working on an old Mars playfield I had, and found that some of the light sockets were in bad shape.
I'm going to try reconnecting the switch, I think that might be it. As far as the light sockets, the ones that aren't lighting at all, I will check the sockets, try tightening them, etc. I did look over the entire underside of the PF when I changed all bulbs, rebuilt pop bumper boards, etc. and didn't notice anything in particular
 
That's interesting about the Ni-Wumpf supposedly ignoring the slam switch, but it also sounded like they blamed the slam switch for the problem. Maybe it needs to be connected?

Any possibility you have some bad/worn light sockets, or maybe a cut in the metal braid? I had issues with GI lights not working on an old Mars playfield I had, and found that some of the light sockets were in bad shape.
I figured out that it was in fact the coin door slam switch that was the culprit. Soldering the 2 wires together has fixed it. The switch test switch 77 is the coin door slam switch. I couldnt find an option to enable slam switch ignore in the menu so why it says it ignores slam switches when it actually doesnt is beyond me.
 
I installed a new Wumpf driver board and repinned most of the pins on the driver board (I ran out of the pins for J3, the slotted edge connector style ones so I only did about half of it). Literally no change to the lamps and coils which are stuck. The F3 fuse for lamps gets quite warm, especially in test mode.

Im going slightly crazy. Help!
 
I still know nothing about Gottlieb but only thing I can offer is simple things;

-Have you verified all voltages are present and correct? (and remain while under load)
-Are your grounds clean and making good connection?
-Is there a switch stuck somewhere that is causing it to not start? I've seen stuck coin switches cause some weird shit.

Can you have the CPU/MPU board mostly unplugged and see if it'll start up? Then plug things in until you find what makes it not work (turn off, plug in next connector, turn on, if still good turn off, plug in next etc.)
 
I still know nothing about Gottlieb but only thing I can offer is simple things;

-Have you verified all voltages are present and correct? (and remain while under load)
-Are your grounds clean and making good connection?
-Is there a switch stuck somewhere that is causing it to not start? I've seen stuck coin switches cause some weird shit.

Can you have the CPU/MPU board mostly unplugged and see if it'll start up? Then plug things in until you find what makes it not work (turn off, plug in next connector, turn on, if still good turn off, plug in next etc.)
Game starts just fine, my problem now is the stuck lamps and coils. All voltages are solid, ground mods done, nothing out of the ordinary on the playfield like a dangling wire or solder splash that I could find. I'm going to recheck my repinning on the interconnect harness between the MPU and the driver board, see if that leads anywhere
 
Okay it was me being a dumbass. I repinned the interconnect harness incorrectly and the first data line signal wasnt being sent from the MPU to the driver board. Due to how Rockwell designed the driver board, when the game is initially powered on, lamps/drivers are left in an indeterminate state. Since the signal never reached the driver board, the indeterminate state was not being overwritten
 
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