Frenzy/Berzerk multi.. interest?

Obviously you never venture over to the chat about anything section. I'm not sure me and Mark will be exchanging Christmas cards this year. Once again, I'm not doubting your ability to make the product. I think I'm the only guy on here who can't make his own stuff. As a person who recently got screwed over in a potential business transaction I appreciate people that put in the legwork to make something happen when it didn't exist before. I basically had someone replace my name at the top of a business plan with their name, make a few minor tweaks and somehow I was left out in the cold. Your product is different in certain regards than Mark's so I didn't/won't pass judgment on you. If you want to make the product go ahead, obviously there's enough interest in the project for you to move forward. At the end of the day it's all about what we're comfortable doing.
 
If the originator is no longer making/selling the product and hasn't recently announced another run then where's the problem?

Speath SW/ESB and Cowgill SW/ESB kits. They both do the same thing don't they?

When you have items made in a small run that are no longer being made but are a hot item - I'd rather see someone else step up and offer an alternative product rather than having to wait for someone to sell their kit, for 3x's what they paid for it. Just my .02
 
tester007 said:
Again, you assume Mark is the only person here capable of making a design or schematic from scratch?
Click to expand...

Dave Fish posted detailed plans (schematics, layout, instructions) over 13 years ago on RGVAC for exactly the kit you propose. So don't try to tell us you're designing this "from scratch".
 
tester007 said:
Hudson, hold on so I can describe in great detail for you and everyone else exactly how ithis will work.....
Actually, maybe its quicker to point you to www.dictionary.com to look up the meaning of the word 'switch'. You do know, there is a mechanical device that shares the same name as 'switch' used as 'to swap' or 'to move' do you not? I do see though how such devices seem magical, or not of us mere mortals to understand for you to be confused on the term, but they are used fairly commonly.. Quit beeing so literal moron. You think I am contemplating sending out some eproms?
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone would read what you wrote as swapping the eproms. It sounded much more like the switch method used in the 4-in-1 pac kits, tempest tubes, Star Wars/ESB, etc. Of course that may have been Hudson's problem with it.
 
myntik1 said:
As a person who recently got screwed over in a potential business transaction I appreciate people that put in the legwork to make something happen when it didn't exist before. .
Click to expand...

That sux.. believe me.. I would rather pay someone and buy something like this than make it myself and spend all the time doing it. ;)
I have asked for kits for games I don't have knowing I will one day have them..like this and qbert.. without 'ever' getting a reply.. and i'm talking for a couple years... Even if someone has made them before, there comes a point if I can do it myself, I will, instead of waiting another year or never getting it. It would be ridiculous to wait for someone who has no interest in doing it again.
If I had an existing product from someone, there would be no need for me to copy it since I already have it, other than a money making venture.. and believe me, I can think of far more things I would rather do to make a buck than 20 or 30 multi pcb's. I somehow cannot picture myself as Scrooge McDuck diving in his money vault after this.
If it was me, and I had a design no-one was buying or I wasn't interested in making, or printing anymore, I personally would just give it away if someone asked.. whats the dif? If I have no plans to ever do anything again with it what would I lose? But thats just me.. I'm sure there are many people out there who would run and sell the awesome artwork by someone like Archer and pay a portion back.. but it never happens.. I just don't understand things like that.

If the person who did it before has an issue, then just re-run a batch..simple... For this I decided to make my own since I love the two games so much and don't want to wait without any replies to pm's or posts anymore. I figure I can do a breadboard up and have a frankenstein looking multi in my game, or spend a couple hundred more on some properly run pcb's and maybe help out some people who much like myself, are just tired of waiting and asking...
 
HudsonArcade said:
Were Fish's plans for a switchable or just frenzy on berzerk? I don't remember offhand....
Click to expand...

Switchable. Here's Dave's intro about it:

ZPU-1000 + Adapter Bd. = Berzerk + Frenzy

Last winter I picked up a Frenzy that used a ZPU-1000 (Berzerk) CPU
board and a small daughter board. The daughter board contained the game
EPROMS and a few IC's. After reverse-engineering this board I started
thinking about the possibility of a daughter board that would allow
either Berzerk or Frenzy to be played.

[About 9 months later....]

I've finally finished building and testing my Berzerk & Frenzy adaptor
board and it works fine so now it's time to let the details out. The adapter
allows a Stern ZPU-1000 board to run either Berzerk or Frenzy. The game
selection is made by flipping a switch (and resetting); no ROM swaps or
cable changing is necessary. The adapter board is fairly small (5" X 2") and
contains two IC's (EPROM, PAL), some caps, resistors, diodes and connectors.
The adapter board requires very little modification to the ZPU: 2 IC leg
cuts and four wires tacked onto points on the ZPU. The adapter itself plugs
into the two connectors, J5 and J6 at the edge of the ZPU. That simple.
I will upload all the necessary documentation to Wiretap in the form of a
ZIP file. The package contains a schematic (B-size postscript), a netlist, a
BOM (Bill of Materials), the .BIN file for the EPROM (27C010), the JEDEC file
for the PAL (22V10) and assembly/installation instructions. Look for a file
called BRZ_FRNZ.ZIP. If you can't get access to Wiretap for one reason or
another, e-mail me and I'll send you out a copy of the zip'ed file.
If someone feels ambitious and wants to make a PCB for this, feel free.
I don't think there's going to be that much demand for it tho'. I built two
by hand since there aren't really that many connections.
I know the question 'Can this work on a ZPU-1001?' will come up eventually
so I'll say up front "I have no idea". I've never seen a 1001. If anyone
wants to send me schematics for it I'd be willing to look into it tho'.
 
mattosborn said:
Dave Fish posted detailed plans (schematics, layout, instructions) over 13 years ago on RGVAC for exactly the kit you propose. So don't try to tell us you're designing this "from scratch".
Click to expand...

Matt, don't worry.. you and your love can have the title of 'bestest two guys' on klov if you want.. I won't take it from you. You can continue to feel important.
I get a kick out of how some people like little kids try and pick apart everything so literally. Making a statement that other people on this forum can design pcb's doesn't necessarily have to do with this thread does it?.. it can be a generalization if it is preceeded with one. If you had a clue about this stuff as a hobbyist, you would probably know what my handle means, and probably like many people here, bought something I designed and built, or a knockoff from one of thousands I had run. I'm really wondering what relevance would it make even if I used some freely posted plans to make some kits for some people so they can enjoy their games? Guys like you just seem to want to argue on things with absolutely no relevance.. because you don't have any. pretty sad..

Anyways, from the group I keep in contact with and talk with, its guys like you that have made klov into the the place it is.. with only one or two holdouts helping people, the good stuff getting sold behind the scenes... If you don't want to buy one of these, then politely fuck off. I don't know why guys like you somehow feel a need to post in threads when you have nothing positive to ad. Its funny how someone can start a thread to make a couple cool devices for other hobbyists then have to spend the next 50 posts clarifying a bunch of crap that doesn't have any relevance at all to anything.. other than to try and make you seem what? like your more important than you are? good for you.. but go and start your own 'im important guys.. and Mark as well.... really!' thread and leave this one alone. I'm done posting on it.. I'll pm the people who responded when I get these done.
 
tester007, I have no idea who you are, and you clearly don't know me. What I do know is that your little rant makes you sound like a real wanker....

I'm pretty sure Dave Fish wouldn't mind if you used his plans to make a few Berzerk/Frenzy multi-game kits for Berzerk boards. All I'm saying is give credit where credit is due.

Matt

tester007 said:
Matt, don't worry.. you and your love can have the title of 'bestest two guys' on klov if you want.. I won't take it from you. You can continue to feel important.
I get a kick out of how some people like little kids try and pick apart everything so literally. Making a statement that other people on this forum can design pcb's doesn't necessarily have to do with this thread does it?.. it can be a generalization if it is preceeded with one. If you had a clue about this stuff as a hobbyist, you would probably know what my handle means, and probably like many people here, bought something I designed and built, or a knockoff from one of thousands I had run. I'm really wondering what relevance would it make even if I used some freely posted plans to make some kits for some people so they can enjoy their games? Guys like you just seem to want to argue on things with absolutely no relevance.. because you don't have any. pretty sad..

Anyways, from the group I keep in contact with and talk with, its guys like you that have made klov into the the place it is.. with only one or two holdouts helping people, the good stuff getting sold behind the scenes... If you don't want to buy one of these, then politely fuck off. I don't know why guys like you somehow feel a need to post in threads when you have nothing positive to ad. Its funny how someone can start a thread to make a couple cool devices for other hobbyists then have to spend the next 50 posts clarifying a bunch of crap that doesn't have any relevance at all to anything.. other than to try and make you seem what? like your more important than you are? good for you.. but go and start your own 'im important guys.. and Mark as well.... really!' thread and leave this one alone. I'm done posting on it.. I'll pm the people who responded when I get these done.
Click to expand...
 
If you can do it, do it. If someone else was currently producing them or had plans to run them again i'd probably bow out but it seems that's not the case currently so full steam ahead. If you do borrow something give credit and move on. I really don't see the reason for the sour grapes personally.
 
prOk said:
If you can do it, do it. If someone else was currently producing them or had plans to run them again i'd probably bow out but it seems that's not the case currently so full steam ahead. If you do borrow something give credit and move on. I really don't see the reason for the sour grapes personally.
Click to expand...

Well said.
 
tester007 said:
<text snipped>I have asked for kits for games I don't have knowing I will one day have them..like this and qbert.. without 'ever' getting a reply.. and i'm talking for a couple years...<text snipped>
Click to expand...

My Multi Q*bert or Clays? I have to ask because my project was all over this forum and Rotheblog in multiple threads and multiple articles. I ran them in Oct of 2006 and again in Oct of 2008, I still have some and can hook you up tonight, just ask!

Since you're getting into the kit business, here's how it goes:

1. The beginning- project X is announced and dozens of people say they'll buy one.
2. Project X is ready to ship and everyone is notified to send their payment.
3. Instead of the dozens that said they want it, only a handful send payment for Project X.
4. Two years later, the last unit of Project X finally sells.
5. The next day, you get an email asking when the next run of Project X is.

6. Intermission- the occasional Project X sells on eBay for 3 times the original price, but you're not the seller.

7. The ending- someone post on a forum complaining about the availability of Project X.

There are set-up charges and minimums for every PCB and artwork project, when you said you've bought parts for games you don't have but plan to own; you're exactly right, I do the same thing. The problem arises when you're dealing with a less than popular title, if someone makes art or a multi kit for that title finally- then that might be the only chance at it you'll get.

FWIW on the Multi Q*bert project I kept a spreadsheet and provided semi-weekly updates via email to everyone that put a deposit down, and shipped on the exact date promised, we also did regular updates via articles on the Rotheblog including an attempt at a surprise title when Tylz was added to the final revision.
 
Why is it that everytime someone announces a new project to contribute to the hobby, it immediatly gets beaten over the head with a stick, stomped on and shit all over by the small group of KLOV elitists? Tester was joking when he made his quip that "apparently noone else is able to make a PCB correctly" but I think he's correct. It seems to me that a few members here think they're the only ones who can do something right and everyone else should be ashamed for even cosidering the notion that they could.
 
Mike Doyle said:
My Multi Q*bert or Clays? I have to ask because my project was all over this forum and Rotheblog in multiple threads and multiple articles. I ran them in Oct of 2006 and again in Oct of 2008, I still have some and can hook you up tonight, just ask!

Since you're getting into the kit business, here's how it goes:

1. The beginning- project X is announced and dozens of people say they'll buy one.
2. Project X is ready to ship and everyone is notified to send their payment.
3. Instead of the dozens that said they want it, only a handful send payment for Project X.
4. Two years later, the last unit of Project X finally sells.
5. The next day, you get an email asking when the next run of Project X is.

6. Intermission- the occasional Project X sells on eBay for 3 times the original price, but you're not the seller.

7. The ending- someone post on a forum complaining about the availability of Project X.

There are set-up charges and minimums for every PCB and artwork project, when you said you've bought parts for games you don't have but plan to own; you're exactly right, I do the same thing. The problem arises when you're dealing with a less than popular title, if someone makes art or a multi kit for that title finally- then that might be the only chance at it you'll get.

FWIW on the Multi Q*bert project I kept a spreadsheet and provided semi-weekly updates via email to everyone that put a deposit down, and shipped on the exact date promised, we also did regular updates via articles on the Rotheblog including an attempt at a surprise title when Tylz was added to the final revision.
Click to expand...

Mike, drop me a pm.. i'm heading out of town for a week for work.. I think late 2006 was when I got back into this hobby.. Had a bunch of games back in 90-'92 or so but sold them all off and got into other things until a couple years ago again and have never been able to find a local qbert, but would buy the kit... Funny.. have posted here looking for one but didn't get a reply, and must have missed your posts.

Anyways, ya.. great description.. but like I said, I wouldn't do this as a money making venture or approach it as such lol! But your point on the setup costs is exactly why I decided to look at making a few extras for people if they wanted them... Started with this just to make one for myself then figured if I'm paying setup fees for mine, the actual pcb's after that are not expensive so run a few off...
 
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