FML :( More Hyperball issues!!!!

Silverunicorn

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Yet MORE Hyperball issues over the weekend.

Turned on the machines in the basement Saturday afternoon because
company was coming over. Attract mode was okay, but the GI relay was
clicking a few times. Then it settled down. Thought nothing more of it


Fast forward about 2 hours. Dad and I go down to the basement to shoot
some pool and play pinball.


Hyperball is still on, but MANY of the controlled lamps were on.
Especially those in the upper left hand side of the PF.


Fired up a game and the game played okay but there were too many
lights lit at once. the regular lights would sequence as in a normal
game, but many others were on as well (ones that you should not be
shooting at at the time).


Turned off the game. waited 2 min, then turned it on again. Same
issues. Powered it down.


Sunday I turned it on and it seemed fine. left it on for an hour and
was fine.


Will leave it powered on longer to see if the issue persists (and try
to get videos or photos if it does), but after all the other issues I
have had, I was wondering if anyone had an idea as to what would have
caused (or IS causing) this issue.


Thanks in advance,
Chris
 
Time to get out the freeze spray and hit chips when its in whacko mode and see if it clears up

You can also hit the suspect PIA with a heat gun (don't burn the IC, just heat it up a bit) when you initially turn it on. If it is heat related, this should force the issue.

Again this is only for troubleshooting intermittent failures that are not failing at the time.

Good luck!
 
Well thank you for the input!

It does indeed seem to be heat related on the PIA chip.

Here's a video I took showing both the issue and a very temporary fix using freeze spray on the PIA:



Guess I will have to do some crash course soldering :(

Thanks again for helping to narrow this down for me!

Chris
 
Yep had the same thing on my Gorgar. Replacing the Lamp PIA fixed the brighter and stuck on lamps. Get a good quality socket and you should be all set.
 
No one suggests busting out the logic probe and actually fixing something? No one asks if the lights are on the same row or column of the matrix? No one even suggests a shorted lamp matrix driver transistor? Just replace the PIA. Yeah...
 
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No one suggests busting out the logic probe and actually fixing something? No one asks if the lights are on the same row or column of the matrix? No one even suggests a shorted lamp matrix driver transistor? Just replace the PIA. Yeah...

Well, the PIA chip gets SCREAMING hot. If I cool it down with the freeze spray, it corrects the issue. Would any of the things you described cause the chip to overheat like that?

How would I go about testing those other things? Also in the Manual (and assuming I will be changing the PIA) it calls out a 6820/21 PIA - does it matter which is used? GPE only has the 6821.

Edit: GPE is out of the 6821's :( Any other good source that someone could reccomend?

Thanks,
Chris
 
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Well, the PIA chip gets SCREAMING hot. If I cool it down with the freeze spray, it corrects the issue. Would any of the things you described cause the chip to overheat like that?

How would I go about testing those other things? Also in the Manual (and assuming I will be changing the PIA) it calls out a 6820/21 PIA - does it matter which is used? GPE only has the 6821.

Edit: GPE is out of the 6821's :( Any other good source that someone could reccomend?

Thanks,
Chris

Missed that part :)

My point is still valid, though it does seem to be the PIA.

EDIT: You would also have been better off using a logic probe rather than the freeze spray anyway (IMO). Sure it revealed the problem this time but you don't want to be thermally shocking components unless it's a last resort and it's a far less accurate method than just looking at the signals that are driving the matrix. Just my $.02.
 
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For the record, SilverUnicorn and I were talking off-forum about this issue, and the logic probe idea was presented. I said "PIA chip failures should be fairly obvious when poking around with a logic probe". He's kinda newbie on the board work side of things, so the freeze spray and "see if any chips feel hot" ideas were accepted as the easy and approachable options.
 
Nothing wrong with freeze spray on a problem like this. It just wouldn't have been my first choice. If you just want the game fixed then the solution that does that is the best. Regardless of what that may be.
 
No one suggests busting out the logic probe and actually fixing something? No one asks if the lights are on the same row or column of the matrix? No one even suggests a shorted lamp matrix driver transistor? Just replace the PIA. Yeah...

Well, when the video shows the issue, he sprays the respective PIA, and the issue is immediately resolved, I think *I'd* go for the PIA in this case as well... ;)

I think I'd have personally checked the interconnect first, and been right with you otherwise checking drivers - I can't say I've every personally done any troubleshooting with freeze spray, but it does have it's uses...
 
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Well, when the video shows the issue, he sprays the respective PIA, and the issue is immediately resolved, I think *I'd* go for the PIA in this case as well... ;)

I think I'd have personally checked the interconnect first, and been right with you otherwise checking drivers - I can't say I've every personally done any troubleshooting with freeze spray, but it does have it's uses...

I hadn't watched the video when I made my first reply but like I said, my point was and still is valid.

I would have gone straight for the PIA too. With a logic probe. I didn't say otherwise. Then I would have traced through the rest of the circuit if necessary and the whole thing would have taken about 2 minutes. That's the advice that should have been given before the video. I hadn't watched the video when I made my first replay, which I acknowledged. What I did say is that it's worthwhile to do some troubleshooting rather than just shotgunning. Then I disagreed about the actual method of troubleshooting. hehe

Like I said... if you just want the game fixed then do whatever the hell makes that happen.
 
Todd's Pinball and Arcade Parts Emporium has three in-stock. I have to check if I have any suitable sockets before we set up a visit.

Oh sweet! I LOVE that place! I tried calling them last night, but there was no answer :(

Big Daddy has new and used (tested) 6821's.

Here is his website:

http://bigdaddy-enterprises.com/

Kid

Thank you for the link. I will try that if Todd does not have the sockets.

Thanks everyone for the help!!

Chris
 
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