Cap Your 90's Midway Sound Boards Immediately

[KaBoom1701]

Well dam... I have a Star Wars Trilogy UR as well. Looks like the same issues on these?

 

[SheepyChris]

90's Sega Model1/2/3 games that were made in USA (most of them) also have these caps on the sound amp boards.
Since the boards are single-sided, the leakage can go under the pads and get to the other side of the PCB, corroding it all.

Even if you have a game with working sound it's probably guaranteed you have at least one leaky cap on these boards. Even if you don't see any damage you'll often hear a sizzle and a "burning rubber" sort of smell when you desolder an offending leaking cap.

Pic below of a capped one on the top, and you can see the damage caused by leaking caps on the bottom one. It's rarely this bad and usually just limited to one or two small areas, or if you're lucky it'll just have a dead/low channel and the cap didn't leak much. But still, have seen it this bad a couple times to the point where it's not worth repairing, and it's because of the same Marcon caps.

These are found in standard (non-DX) games like VF1/2/3, Virtua Cop 1&2, Gunblade, LA Machineguns, Ocean Hunter, Star Wars Trilogy UR, Fighting Vipers, Virtua Striker & all Sega drivers like Daytona, Rally, Indy 500, Super GT, etc.

I've done at least 30 of these Sega amps. They're not fun, but it's necessary to do, just like on everything WMS ever made in the 90s. There are a couple minor variations in cap values, but Peter should probably sell a kit for these. If you have one, it needs them replaced.
View attachment 800186

I commend you for servicing those boards. I recently had to come up with a solution to replace two entirely dead sound amps on a set of Daytona 2s for a customer - it's very often to see multiple boards being killed by dirt, grime and snow slush getting under the seat here in Canada. One of the amp boards was so bad that both front Gullbox speakers were shorted out and killed from the AC/DC diode bridge burning up. The replacement solution works pretty well, not perfect and elegant but time wasn't on my side either.

 

[pat9000]

Yeah, some (most?) of the model 3 games use that newer type of Japanese amp. They generally don't have issues and use better-quality caps. It looks like they're using United Chemi-Con caps, which should have a decent life on the sound boards. Super GT uses 2 of the "bad" sound boards instead of that newer type, but I also recall seeing them with Japanese amps and with USA amps using Marcon caps, so you might get lucky with that game.

Crap getting to the boards is an issue with all Sega twins. Daytona USAs use a different 2-channel stereo amp that rarely has issues, but the EQ/sub amp board is similar to the 2-channel amps I showed above. Thankfully Daytona & Rally's amp boards are mostly clear of the "cracks" in the footwell, but not-so-thankfully the sound board itself is prone to taking spills, dirt & sand along with the drive board.

 

[demogo]

Let us know? Sounds like I need kits for my Smash TV and my T2. Both are in storage, so I can't get to them, but I'll buy the kits so I'll be ready, if I know what to get.

I could use a cap kit for my Smash TV sound card as well. @security0001

I was told a couple of years ago that those caps didn't leak but did go bad, so I didn't sweat it. If they DO leak, then I need to get them off ASAP.

I recapped my NBA JAM TE sound board a couple of years ago and it fixed some intermittent sound issues I was having.

 

[security0001]

I could use a cap kit for my Smash TV sound card as well. @security0001

I was told a couple of years ago that those caps didn't leak but did go bad, so I didn't sweat it. If they DO leak, then I need to get them off ASAP.

I recapped my NBA JAM TE sound board a couple of years ago and it fixed some intermittent sound issues I was having.

what is the model number of that sound board you want a kit for??

 

[security0001]

I searched the APAR site for the T2 sound board PN A-14732-40009 and SmashTV sound board D-11581-3044, and neither came up. @security0001, are there alternate PNs that match these boards or are there no pre-assembled kits for these? They are the two I need to do!

Midway Mortal Kombat 1 sound pcb 105c Cap Kit-Arcade Parts and Repair

Midway Mortal Kombat 1 Sound A-14732-40025 PCB 105C cap kit. This Mortal Kombat I “Mega Deluxe Cap Kit” has a total of 24 Capacitors.

www.arcadepartsandrepair.com

and i emailed you about checking to make sure this is the same as the other one.

Williams D-11581-574 Audio Sound PCB 105C Cap Kit - Arcade Parts and Repair

Williams D-11581-574 Audio Sound PCB 105C Cap Kit. Williams sound board cap kit works on system 11B pinball games like Whirlwind & any others

www.arcadepartsandrepair.com

 

[ccie38296]

Midway Mortal Kombat 1 sound pcb 105c Cap Kit-Arcade Parts and Repair

Midway Mortal Kombat 1 Sound A-14732-40025 PCB 105C cap kit. This Mortal Kombat I “Mega Deluxe Cap Kit” has a total of 24 Capacitors.

www.arcadepartsandrepair.com

and i emailed you about checking to make sure this is the same as the other one.

Williams D-11581-574 Audio Sound PCB 105C Cap Kit - Arcade Parts and Repair

Williams D-11581-574 Audio Sound PCB 105C Cap Kit. Williams sound board cap kit works on system 11B pinball games like Whirlwind & any others

www.arcadepartsandrepair.com

Yep, sorry for poking you from two directions, wasn't sure how often you hit this forum so I figured I'd email you as well. I responded a this evening with some details so we can hopefully confirm the SmashTV kit.

 

[demogo]

Yep, sorry for poking you from two directions, wasn't sure how often you hit this forum so I figured I'd email you as well. I responded a this evening with some details so we can hopefully confirm the SmashTV kit.

If you've provided Security0001 the Smash TV info, I won't bother moving my games around and taking that one apart to get the info.

Please keep me in the loop!

 

[mecha]

@security0001 why don't you just label them by CVSD/ADPCM in addition to the convoluted D-1248067148061408 Williams number?

 

[KaBoom1701]

Wow... Your using too much brain power buddy. Slow down. Lol

@security0001 why don't you just label them by CVSD/ADPCM in addition to the convoluted D-1248067148061408 Williams number?

 

[DrewZ]

Got me thinking about our Hydro Thunder
When you're looking for cabaret's and this shows up

 

[ccie38296]

OK here's the answer from Peter at APAR regarding SmashTV:

Yes that D-11581 kit will work for the smash tv but the axial caps on your board are tantalum (the type at C1, C3, C4, etc ) and those we don't include in the kit but they are on the site individually. The kit does include axial electrolytic which the other versions of the D11581 use so they may work fine but I haven't had a smash tv audio board to know if there is anything odd that requires them

Not sure if others with SmashTV also have tantalum caps at C1, C3, C4, C8, C11, and C17. I would assume so. This is a picture of my sound board.




Peter confirmed his kit would have the correct electrolytics I need for the radial caps on STV though.

 

[LittleLarrySellr]

Tantalum don't have the same risk of leaking, right? It's just they might explode or dead short at some point?

 

[Shavenyak]

OK here's the answer from Peter at APAR regarding SmashTV:



Not sure if others with SmashTV also have tantalum caps at C1, C3, C4, C8, C11, and C17. I would assume so. This is a picture of my sound board.


View attachment 801048

Peter confirmed his kit would have the correct electrolytics I need for the radial caps on STV though.

THe STV manual calls for a 10uFd 20V cap w/ a +20% tolerance at C1, C3, C4, & C8. Will this work, even though it only has a 10% tolerance? https://www.arcadepartsandrepair.co...ors/10uf-25v-tantalum-axial-capacitor-mc1048/

As for C11 and C17, I can't even find those in the manual, much less determine their value.

 

[ccie38296]

THe STV manual calls for a 10uFd 20V cap w/ a +20% tolerance at C1, C3, C4, & C8. Will this work, even though it only has a 10% tolerance? https://www.arcadepartsandrepair.co...ors/10uf-25v-tantalum-axial-capacitor-mc1048/

As for C11 and C17, I can't even find those in the manual, much less determine their value.

I would definitely reach out to @security0001 for guidance there. I wasn't planning to replace the tantalum caps, I am under the impression they do not experience the same level of time-based degradation and leaking as metal-case electrolytics. If I'm wrong hopefully someone will correct me.

I did find it interesting that C11 and C17 are not mentioned in the manual schematics at all.

 

[Pondscum]

Smaller tolerance value means closer to listed value (tighter tolerance). Your 10u cap with 20% tolerance is +-2u for an acceptable range of 8-12u , 10u with 10% tolerance is +-1u for a range of 9-11u.

 

[ccie38296]

Need some advice or a cross-check on the board for my SmashTV 19". I sat down to do several soldering projects today, including the cap kit from APAR for this game, but some parts aren't matching up and I need to figure out if my game has incorrect parts installed or if the manual is incorrect. Worth noting that although I don't know the full history of the board, my game is a 19" SmashTV which was one of the early runs before the switched to the larger 25" cabinet.

Sound board has 5766-13702-00 screened on it, and the manual calls it D-11581-3044.

I asked @security0001 and he said his kit for the D-11581 series should work. My board has tantalum caps instead of electrolytic for the axials but Peter said I could skip those, so no problem there.



There are 7 radial electrolytic caps:

C12, C19, C24, all rated as 100uF 35V per the manual, and

C26, C30 (470 uF 16V)
C29, C32 (1000 uF, 16V)

For C26,29,30,32 the board has 85* Nichicon VR(M)s installed in the correct values with 2022 date codes.




Guessing someone did these a few years ago before I bought the game although not with the same caps Peter provides.

But C12,19,24 all presently are populated with 150uF 35V caps, whereas the manual and the cap kit specify 100uF 35V. These are Nichicon 105* PF(M) caps with 1999 date codes, so clearly replaced at some point after the game was manufactured:



So two questions:

1. Worth replacing 2022 85* caps with same rating 105* 2023 caps for those 4?

2. Should I replace the 1999 150uF caps with new 100uF caps, which match the manual? Or might there have been a reason 150's were installed?

I am *guessing* these may all have been replaced at the same time as all 7 of the caps are cut VERY flush on the underside, no "nub" of the lead poking out of the solder as all the factory parts have. But if that's true, whoever did it installed 20 year old caps with what looks to be the wrong rating for 3 of the locations.

The game/sound work 100% fine on this game right now, so I'm not looking to unnecessarily tickle the dragon here, I was just trying to be proactive per @zenomorp's advice in this thread!

Thanks for any thoughts or advice here!

 

[rkdavid]

As for C11 and C17, I can't even find those in the manual, much less determine their value.

Did anyone ever determine the value of these?

 

[Marquee Mark]

Need some advice or a cross-check on the board for my SmashTV 19". I sat down to do several soldering projects today, including the cap kit from APAR for this game, but some parts aren't matching up and I need to figure out if my game has incorrect parts installed or if the manual is incorrect. Worth noting that although I don't know the full history of the board, my game is a 19" SmashTV which was one of the early runs before the switched to the larger 25" cabinet.

Sound board has 5766-13702-00 screened on it, and the manual calls it D-11581-3044.

I asked @security0001 and he said his kit for the D-11581 series should work. My board has tantalum caps instead of electrolytic for the axials but Peter said I could skip those, so no problem there.

View attachment 803533

There are 7 radial electrolytic caps:

C12, C19, C24, all rated as 100uF 35V per the manual, and

C26, C30 (470 uF 16V)
C29, C32 (1000 uF, 16V)

For C26,29,30,32 the board has 85* Nichicon VR(M)s installed in the correct values with 2022 date codes.

View attachment 803534
View attachment 803535

Guessing someone did these a few years ago before I bought the game although not with the same caps Peter provides.

But C12,19,24 all presently are populated with 150uF 35V caps, whereas the manual and the cap kit specify 100uF 35V. These are Nichicon 105* PF(M) caps with 1999 date codes, so clearly replaced at some point after the game was manufactured:

View attachment 803536

So two questions:

1. Worth replacing 2022 85* caps with same rating 105* 2023 caps for those 4?

2. Should I replace the 1999 150uF caps with new 100uF caps, which match the manual? Or might there have been a reason 150's were installed?

I am *guessing* these may all have been replaced at the same time as all 7 of the caps are cut VERY flush on the underside, no "nub" of the lead poking out of the solder as all the factory parts have. But if that's true, whoever did it installed 20 year old caps with what looks to be the wrong rating for 3 of the locations.

The game/sound work 100% fine on this game right now, so I'm not looking to unnecessarily tickle the dragon here, I was just trying to be proactive per @zenomorp's advice in this thread!

Thanks for any thoughts or advice here!

I'd at the very least replace those 20+ year old caps. They have a shelf life even if not installed. I'm no expert by any means, but that should be done even if its working now.

For piece of mind, I'd replace them all just for future maintenance purposes. If I'm recapping, recap them all, rather then some at X date and others at Y date.

With regards to the µF value, go with whatever

security0001

recommends. Generally, the correct µF value should be used, and the voltage needs to be equal or higher.

 

[gutz]

Need some advice or a cross-check on the board for my SmashTV 19". I sat down to do several soldering projects today, including the cap kit from APAR for this game, but some parts aren't matching up and I need to figure out if my game has incorrect parts installed or if the manual is incorrect. Worth noting that although I don't know the full history of the board, my game is a 19" SmashTV which was one of the early runs before the switched to the larger 25" cabinet.

Sound board has 5766-13702-00 screened on it, and the manual calls it D-11581-3044.

I asked @security0001 and he said his kit for the D-11581 series should work. My board has tantalum caps instead of electrolytic for the axials but Peter said I could skip those, so no problem there.

View attachment 803533

There are 7 radial electrolytic caps:

C12, C19, C24, all rated as 100uF 35V per the manual, and

C26, C30 (470 uF 16V)
C29, C32 (1000 uF, 16V)

For C26,29,30,32 the board has 85* Nichicon VR(M)s installed in the correct values with 2022 date codes.

View attachment 803534
View attachment 803535

Guessing someone did these a few years ago before I bought the game although not with the same caps Peter provides.

But C12,19,24 all presently are populated with 150uF 35V caps, whereas the manual and the cap kit specify 100uF 35V. These are Nichicon 105* PF(M) caps with 1999 date codes, so clearly replaced at some point after the game was manufactured:

View attachment 803536

So two questions:

1. Worth replacing 2022 85* caps with same rating 105* 2023 caps for those 4?

2. Should I replace the 1999 150uF caps with new 100uF caps, which match the manual? Or might there have been a reason 150's were installed?

I am *guessing* these may all have been replaced at the same time as all 7 of the caps are cut VERY flush on the underside, no "nub" of the lead poking out of the solder as all the factory parts have. But if that's true, whoever did it installed 20 year old caps with what looks to be the wrong rating for 3 of the locations.

The game/sound work 100% fine on this game right now, so I'm not looking to unnecessarily tickle the dragon here, I was just trying to be proactive per @zenomorp's advice in this thread!

Thanks for any thoughts or advice here!

1. No, not worth the extra heat cycle and potential damage to the traces for such a marginal gain.
2. Yes, put the ones from the cap kit in. They are the wrong value because the last tech said 'meh - they're close enough and I already have them'.