Best and worst brands of redemption machines ?

ArcRevival

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I have worked on machines by 5 Star and Smart Industries. Both seem decent. Haven't worked on any that were really bad yet. What would you say are the best and worst as far as cranes and ticket redemption games go ?
 
Hi.

I've never been all that wild about 5 star / Planet Earth games. The ICE redemption games I've worked on in the past are of decent design. Skee Ball is a good redemption game as well. NSG (Super Shot) too.

Gynotai
 
Andamiro games are ones that I generally despise working on. They always seem to have a few strange quirks to them and the manuals and operator menu screens are poorly translated to English.

I like ICE games a lot, they are usually well engineered, easy to work on and hold up well. Most of the companies that build redemption games make decent equipment but it seems like every company has that one game that is a nightmare to keep running.
 
Sorry if my reviews seem too negative or cynical. I've been
in this industry for a long time. I've worked on a LOT of
redemption equipment. A lot of games are really well built
and thought out but some companies just don't put any
thought into their design or they just don't care. Most
companies learn from their mistakes and improve their
product. Some have said what the hell we need to up our
product margin so we'll just import a load toxic Chinese
junk (if you've ever opened a container of their games
the you know what formaldehyde smells like).

So here we go, in no particular order:

5 Star (Planet Earth):
Complete and utter crap. If you've worked on a Dino
Score or Surfin' Safari then you know what I'm talking about.

Smart:
More or less crap. If you've worked on a Smartball or a
ticket center you know what I'm talking about. Remember
the photo booth with the HP inkjet printer ? And how many
hours have YOU spent trying to get that damned ticket
center to accurately count tickets ?

ICE:
Used to be a lot better. Their newer board systems aren't
nearly reliable and as easy to repair as their games from not
so long ago. Their tech support is usually pretty helpful but
shame on them for what they sell replacement Deal or No Deal
computers for $$$ !

Skeeball:
Oh why oh why did you redesign the Super Shot boards ?
Aside from that, not too bad.

Baytek:
Not bad. I've never had major problems with any of their
equipment and their tech support was always helpful.

Benchmark:
Mixed bag. Most games are pretty well designed. Schematics
would really be welcome but good luck with that. If you've
worked on a Drill-o-matic you know where I'm coming from.

Bob's Space Racers:
Pricey but really well built.

Andamiro:
Imported junk.

Lazer Tron (deceased):
Not bad. Most of their equipment was pretty reliable
and easy to repair.

Namco:
Newer stuff ok. Dishonorary mention goes to
Crappy Crab and Wackoff Gator - If you've worked on
one you know what I'm talking about.

Coastal Amusements:
Crap, Crap and more Crap.

LAI Games:
Mixed thoughts. Some of their equipment was always trouble
free but Stacker, oh Stacker. Yeah, you know where I'm coming from
if you've had one of the prize sensors go bad. Every now and then
I'd get a board in that was paying out wayyyyy too many wins. No
help from support. Here's a hint - replace the CPU and the couple of
RAM chips. It's about $15 worth of parts and solves all your problems.

And avoid like the plague:
Harry Levy, Cromptons and Bromley
 
I have heard ICE is good. I worked on a Dinoscore but only had to replace the sensor on the gun and the motor. Wasn't a big deal. What about Challenger ? How bad are those ?

As for Smart, I worked on a Candy Crane and it didn't seem that bad. At least their tech support was good.
 
I have heard ICE is good. I worked on a Dinoscore but only had to replace the sensor on the gun and the motor. Wasn't a big deal. What about Challenger ? How bad are those ?

As for Smart, I worked on a Candy Crane and it didn't seem that bad. At least their tech support was good.

Smart cranes - yuck !

They have those brass worm drives on the motors and gears on the shafts.
When a switch fails or the gantry gets stuck the motor keeps going and shreds
the corkscrew drive. You then have to kiss away $150 for a new motor and you'd
better fix the underlying problem first before installing the new one. At least
Elaut uses replaceable nylon gears on the shafts which break without destroying
the motor.

Challenger what ? The cranes ?

JD
 
Sorry if my reviews seem too negative or cynical. I've been
in this industry for a long time. I've worked on a LOT of
redemption equipment. A lot of games are really well built
and thought out but some companies just don't put any
thought into their design or they just don't care. Most
companies learn from their mistakes and improve their
product. Some have said what the hell we need to up our
product margin so we'll just import a load toxic Chinese
junk (if you've ever opened a container of their games
the you know what formaldehyde smells like).

So here we go, in no particular order:

5 Star (Planet Earth):
Complete and utter crap. If you've worked on a Dino
Score or Surfin' Safari then you know what I'm talking about.

Smart:
More or less crap. If you've worked on a Smartball or a
ticket center you know what I'm talking about. Remember
the photo booth with the HP inkjet printer ? And how many
hours have YOU spent trying to get that damned ticket
center to accurately count tickets ?

ICE:
Used to be a lot better. Their newer board systems aren't
nearly reliable and as easy to repair as their games from not
so long ago. Their tech support is usually pretty helpful but
shame on them for what they sell replacement Deal or No Deal
computers for $$$ !

Skeeball:
Oh why oh why did you redesign the Super Shot boards ?
Aside from that, not too bad.

Baytek:
Not bad. I've never had major problems with any of their
equipment and their tech support was always helpful.

Benchmark:
Mixed bag. Most games are pretty well designed. Schematics
would really be welcome but good luck with that. If you've
worked on a Drill-o-matic you know where I'm coming from.

Bob's Space Racers:
Pricey but really well built.

Andamiro:
Imported junk.

Lazer Tron (deceased):
Not bad. Most of their equipment was pretty reliable
and easy to repair.

Namco:
Newer stuff ok. Dishonorary mention goes to
Crappy Crab and Wackoff Gator - If you've worked on
one you know what I'm talking about.

Coastal Amusements:
Crap, Crap and more Crap.

LAI Games:
Mixed thoughts. Some of their equipment was always trouble
free but Stacker, oh Stacker. Yeah, you know where I'm coming from
if you've had one of the prize sensors go bad. Every now and then
I'd get a board in that was paying out wayyyyy too many wins. No
help from support. Here's a hint - replace the CPU and the couple of
RAM chips. It's about $15 worth of parts and solves all your problems.

And avoid like the plague:
Harry Levy, Cromptons and Bromley[/

PFFFFFTTTTT WACKOFF GATOR!
 
Andamiro games are ones that I generally despise working on. They always seem to have a few strange quirks to them and the manuals and operator menu screens are poorly translated to English.

I like ICE games a lot, they are usually well engineered, easy to work on and hold up well. Most of the companies that build redemption games make decent equipment but it seems like every company has that one game that is a nightmare to keep running.

How DARE you curse the western train. GREATEST GAME EVER CREATED, and u know it.

Mike
 
You got me there, I like my Western Train to play and watch. Who doesn't like train based games? But it is a PITA to work on. I got mine at a really good price from a distributor that had enough of trying to fix it.

Even the Marquee is badly translated, it says "Players enjoy controlling the Train directly"

But the good thing about Andamiro is that they seem to keep parts available forever for their games.
 
Andamiro's redemption stuff must not be up to the same caliber as the PiU cabinets then. Pump pads are famous for being nigh indestructible. The cab itself is quirky, but straightforward, and they use decent parts.

FWIW, Lasertron is still around. They just abandoned redemption games and are focusing on their large attractions now (like their cash cow laser tag system, but rumor has it they have self-driving go-karts in the works).

Anywho, my 2c:

Bay-Tek:
We're a fellow WI company and have a strong relationship with them, so this goes with a grain of salt, but hey. We have more of their pieces than anyone else's, and I see their prototypes roll through every few months since they're nearby. Their early stuff from the Seidel buyout/transition usually has an annoying quirk or two but is otherwise pretty strong. What I like the most is you can get pretty much anywhere in their cabinets with nothing more than a Robertson #2 screwdriver (and of course, the keys). I really enjoy working on Bay-Tek stuff -- every design is obvious and straightforward.

Bromley:
We have one piece, an old-style Colorama 2-player, quite possibly the oldest machine we have. The CPU board has an official Zilog Z80 and PDIP RAM. Very oldschool, very solid. It Just. Won't. Die. Extremely awkward to work on though -- they didn't put much thought into maintenance.

Benchmark:
Garbage, garbage, garbage. Cuts corners like you wouldn't believe. Makes dumb assumptions that make the games do unexpected things as a course of normal functioning, and this occasionally pisses off customers. EXTREMELY voltage sensitive, especially on the 12V, and the OEM power supplies aren't adjustable, so plan on buying a new power supply right out of the gate. 11.80 at the stepper controller board will make steppers periodically misbehave -- good luck getting the proper voltage to the damned thing.

Bob's Space Racers:
We have one piece, an oldschool mechanical Dog Pounder and it requires constant attention. I'm convinced BSR can't design an opto to save their life. The arm has a tendency to strip boltholes and bend things in weird ways, too. Still, I've dealt with worse.

Family Fun Companies:
And I thought Benchmark was bad. Every single thing inside every machine was imported from a lowest bidder in China. Everything breaks, even the flippin' doors. If you run tokens, expect cashboxes to go missng because some doors will cave in with a good kick from a 12-year-old. Every game of theirs that we have has so far developed an odd intermittent quirk that creates a real gameplay problem but I can't for the life of me get it to go away.

ICE:
I'm convinced they don't actually design their own games. We have two Cyclones, two Hoop Fevers, and a Deal Or No Deal, and there's absolutely no design consistency between them. I like the DOND cabinet -- virtually everything that might break is very easy to access. It does have the flaky PlayMechanix computer though. Cyclones are just goofy -- very oddball proprietary motherboard that integrates a gigantic power supply right next to the logic. Awkward to work in too, and they get really warm inside.

Jumping Bean:
Incredibly flimsy coin pushers imported from Europe, which drives parts prices through the roof. Expect to spend several days fiddling with it trying to get the coins to travel through it correctly, then do it all again when you have to take the playfield out because it jammed. Do yourself a favor and remove the sound board, or you'll have guests filing out the fire exits every time it runs out of tickets.

Namco:
Incredibly strong build quality, but expect all the weird quirks that come with Japanese designers. Bring a good set of TR Torx bits, and make sure they're the good kind with the full-depth holes because their screws have some really long TR studs. Oh, and if you need a part, kiss your wallet goodbye.

Skee-Ball:
Flaky at times, but not as bad as some. Their "longboards" have a surface-mount CPU set in a socket -- that should tell you something. Has an unhealthy infatuation with unprotected AC relays driving incandescant lamps. Again, absolutely no thought given to in-the-field maintenance; approach problems knowing you'll need some dexterity and a little acrobatic talent. Their cabinets look and feel flimsy, but seem to hold up for the most part.

We also have a Komuse Key Master but it's only been a few months. Initial impressions aren't all that good -- it arrived with screws missing, a damaged joystick, and several dead fluorescent ballasts.
 
Last edited:
Smart cranes - yuck !

They have those brass worm drives on the motors and gears on the shafts.
When a switch fails or the gantry gets stuck the motor keeps going and shreds
the corkscrew drive. You then have to kiss away $150 for a new motor and you'd
better fix the underlying problem first before installing the new one. At least
Elaut uses replaceable nylon gears on the shafts which break without destroying
the motor.

Challenger what ? The cranes ?

JD

Didn't know that about the motors. Who makes the best cranes ?
 
Oh yeah - forgot about Family Fun !

Make sure you keep a stockpile of motors for the
King's Castle because they burn out every 4 months.

JD
 
Didn't know that about the motors. Who makes the best cranes ?

Very pricey but Elaut's quality is tops (I worked for them for 3 years).

Everything else available now is China import garbage.

JD
 
IMO, ICE makes the best quality cranes. The whole claw carriage comes out of the game easily with 1 connector and a thumbscrew. There are 8 belts throughout the whole assembly instead of the 2 in a normal crane. Everything is built much more robust than any other brand I've owned or worked on.

I usually buy Coastal Amusements cranes, even though they're cheap Chinese crap, because they pay themselves off within a couple months in the right location. I can buy 2 costal cranes and fill them with merchandise for the price of one ICE crane.

Smart is my least favorite, considering how many up/down motors I've replaced among our 5th/6th/7th gen models, and how difficult it is to replace on location.
 
IMO, ICE makes the best quality cranes. The whole claw carriage comes out of the game easily with 1 connector and a thumbscrew. There are 8 belts throughout the whole assembly instead of the 2 in a normal crane. Everything is built much more robust than any other brand I've owned or worked on.

I usually buy Coastal Amusements cranes, even though they're cheap Chinese crap, because they pay themselves off within a couple months in the right location. I can buy 2 costal cranes and fill them with merchandise for the price of one ICE crane.

Smart is my least favorite, considering how many up/down motors I've replaced among our 5th/6th/7th gen models, and how difficult it is to replace on location.

For the most part I agree with you on ICE cranes but the claws are difficult
to adjust for merchandise. They don't seem to have a lot of grabbing power
even when set to 100%. That actually makes a lot of operators happy but many
NJ locations are play to win and I've seen a lot of coils fry in busy locations.
Their boards are the easiest to repair, usually an occasional bad TIP 122 in
the H-Bridge.

I agree with you on Smart or Coastal. The China cranes have their
quirks but usually are surprisingly reliable.

JD
 
Oh yeah - forgot about Family Fun !

Make sure you keep a stockpile of motors for the
King's Castle because they burn out every 4 months.

JD

They made a firmware update for KC that turns off the cauldron motor when nobody is playing. Call them and ask about it.

Made a HUGE difference on ours.
 
They made a firmware update for KC that turns off the cauldron motor when nobody is playing. Call them and ask about it.

Made a HUGE difference on ours.

Thanks, that's great. The company I work
for got rid of theirs but good info for the
future.

JD
 
I'll look into that also.

Personal preference, but I like most of benchmark's stuff, and ICE doesn't seem to cause many problems either if it is properly grounded, but by far the worst is Lazertron, who is now bought out by so-and-so, etc. We have a Lot-O-Fun that is the biggest piece of shit ever. Had to track down one of the original engineers just to get the right settings for the stepgate that runs the motor, I swear NASA shuttles are less complicated than this tghing!
 
I also agree on ICE making the best cranes compared to smart and coastal. As for them not having a lot of grabbing power I have never seen this problem. There are a few things you can do if you need to pay out every play that might help. First bend/adjust the claws that are already on the game. Secondly ICE sells at least 2, but I'm pretty sure 3 sizes of claws. Finally put electrical tape on the tips of the claw or pinball post rubbers to help grab product.

For the most part I agree with you on ICE cranes but the claws are difficult
to adjust for merchandise. They don't seem to have a lot of grabbing power
even when set to 100%. That actually makes a lot of operators happy but many
NJ locations are play to win and I've seen a lot of coils fry in busy locations.
Their boards are the easiest to repair, usually an occasional bad TIP 122 in
the H-Bridge.

I agree with you on Smart or Coastal. The China cranes have their
quirks but usually are surprisingly reliable.

JD
 
I am a big fan of Benchmark games as a customer/guest. They are easy to understand for the most part, anyone can play them, and usually pretty colorful. However working on them is a completely different story, talk about a R&D team that doesn't look at how games will be worked on in the field. Having to work on a slam a winner you have to get half your body into the game along with having the bottom part of the door jammed into your back, this is the same with pop it for gold, big haul, wheel deal, and numerous other games. Plus their Intelli-ticket dispensers suck in my opinion. Also I really believe their tech support is made up of people they just pull off the street that have never seen one of their games; they seem to know nothing about their games. Finally their Tickets to Prizes machines are the biggest pieces of junk ever made. I would rather work on smart ticket centers over these.

I'll look into that also.

Personal preference, but I like most of benchmark's stuff, and ICE doesn't seem to cause many problems either if it is properly grounded, but by far the worst is Lazertron, who is now bought out by so-and-so, etc. We have a Lot-O-Fun that is the biggest piece of shit ever. Had to track down one of the original engineers just to get the right settings for the stepgate that runs the motor, I swear NASA shuttles are less complicated than this tghing!
 
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