25" TV Monitors for Starwars Cockpits Project

[dezbaz]

Hi Guys

This is about making Starwars 25" monitors from a NEC 25" TV, IE the one in the wooden box - All you TV collectors / hoarders like me, know the TV I mean

I spoke to Jomac the other day, he was kind enough to read to me the neck pinouts for the NEC 25"

I was looking at the pinouts of the Amplifone / Rauland monitor as he read them to me from his book - Guess what - they were identical to each other

For a TV to be usable as a Vector monitor, the following must be compatible
1. Neck Size
2. Neck Pinout
3. Neck pin Pattern and size
4. Deflection angle
5. HV value
6. Yoke resistance and Impedance
7. Heater Voltage

Ok, so:
They are identical pinouts

Now the Yoke on a 25" Amplifone is different to the 19" Amplifone.
The 25" SW used the WG6100 Yoke like this below, and is suited to 100 degree deflection angle tubes

Click enlarge

The 19" one looks like this by the way

The 19" Amplifone YOKE is a 90 degree, so the yoke is not really compatible with the TV will be trying to use here.

So back to our list
1. Neck Size (Check) ie Yes
2. Neck Pinout (Check)
3. Neck pin Pattern and size (Check)
4. Deflection angle (Check - 100 degree)
5. HV value (Unknown as yet)
6. Yoke resistance and Impedance (Must have original WG 6100 Yoke) - Sorry
7. Heater Voltage (Unknown as yet)

So what I intend to do is actually prove this can be done

I will document the path I take until we all see it working

Items needed
A. Working 25" Starwars Machine (Check)
B. Spare WG 6100 Deflection Yoke (Check)
C. NEC 25" TV's (Check)
D. HV Probe and Scope (Check)
E. Rings and wedges to suit (Check)

Those who know me will also know I take forever, but get there eventually. So jump onboard, but be patient

Input is welcome

 

[dezbaz]

Found this, could be handy

 

[RetroHacker]

This has been done before. The standard 100 degree 25" tubes have the same electrical pinout and connector as the Amplifone tube. The only tricky part is getting the convergence right.

Heater voltage is the same. Keep your HV voltage the same too.

-Ian

 

[LongJohns]

Hi Guys

This is about making Starwars 25" monitors from a NEC 25" TV, IE the one in the wooden box - All you TV collectors / hoarders like me, know the TV I mean

...for those newbies like me...

Would you care to elobrate on which tv this is exaclty (pic/model). Something that I could keep an eye out for should I require one in the future. Have to get them while one still can.

Thanks and thank you for starting a write up - I appreciate this stuff as I have so much catching up to do.

 

[horseboy]

What chassis are you using?

 

[RetroHacker]

...for those newbies like me...

Would you care to elobrate on which tv this is exaclty (pic/model). Something that I could keep an eye out for should I require one in the future. Have to get them while one still can.

Thanks and thank you for starting a write up - I appreciate this stuff as I have so much catching up to do.

It shouldn't matter what model set it is. Most 25" tv's have compatible 100 degree picture tubes. Just pop the back off and verify it has the same neck connector (it's also known as the "CR23" pinout, after the name of the B&K adapter).

The reason he has to change the yoke is that the Amplifone tube is a standard 90 degree 19" tube. When they went to 25" they increased the deflection angle to 100 degrees - otherwise the tube would be too deep. Really old console sets from the 60's had 90 degree 25" tubes. They are *very* deep.

For whatever reason, the WG6100 has a 100 degree 19" tube. That type of tube is pretty rare in TV's.

-Ian

 

[RetroHacker]

What chassis are you using?

He'd use the Amplifone chassis. The same chassis was used in both the 19" and 25" Amplifone vector monitors.

-Ian

 

[horseboy]

Thanks. This is good info. I will be on the lookout for a beatup cockpit project now.

 

[dezbaz]

This is a reference thread

All the info will get answered as it comes to hand

Yes, it is an Amplifone HV and Deflection board used.

If people have info on previous efforts, links or info it would be appreciated if you add it in here

Cheers

 

[dezbaz]

Today I hooked up the 25" TV tube from an NEC TV

I fitted the Yoke from a WG6100, and the convergence rings from the TV

It does work, so good news there.

When I hook up the original tube in the SW Cockpit, I can focus, but it's at the end of it's travel. I would like more travel in the pot.

When I hook up the new tube, I can't achieve focus. I hit the end of the travel and it's still a bit blurry

Anyone know what I can do?

By the way I have a bob roberts new flyback fitted

 

[Level42]

Huh, does BR sell the Amplifone flybacks now ?

After you solve the focus problem I will be VERY interested if you'll get it converged properly. That's still the big issue I have seen so far on 25" low res tubes in both Amplifone and WG6100 set-ups.

 

[dezbaz]

All sorted - got focus now

I read this here (Tells you how to make a focus assembly from and old TV Flyback)
http://www.electronicrepairguide.com/flyback-divider.html

And found out focus assemblies go out of wack with time due to heat

I had a trashed Amplifone HV board I could pinch one off - All good now

So, in conclusion:

• Some convergence rings from TVs work better than others
• I do have some bowing on the LHS of the screen.
• You will need to degauss the screen, naturally
• Ensure the DAG lead / strap is in good condition, if in doubt replace it. The HV uses the DAG as it's zero volts reference for the focus network
• The position of the convergence rings is not too fussy, they seemed to work in the same over a range of positions
• There are 2 types of HV boards I know of, this is done using a Revision A201012-02 HV PCB
• I will be firing up the next one soon, now I have 2 x 25" screens

 

[dezbaz]

After you solve the focus problem I will be VERY interested if you'll get it converged properly. That's still the big issue I have seen so far on 25" low res tubes in both Amplifone and WG6100 set-ups.

Are all of these TVs only low res?

Are some better than others etc?

 

[omegaman]

You could try winding the HV up a little, you could set it at 22kv with no problems, then try adjusting the brightness/focus. Maybe you have a problem with you HV board, I'd check that first...can you measure the focus voltage?
You would need to adjust the x and y size as the picture will be smaller at the higher voltage.
Don't worry about the X-ray talk....there won't be any, if you did crank it right up then maybe standing near the back of the tube(neck) or to the side may be a risk if you wanted to sit strapped to it for a few weeks.

 

[dezbaz]

Yes, thanks for that, it took me a while to realize that.

I turned the brightness down and the focus improved.

So in regards to the frequency on the HV, what is the best way to set that? Does it matter?

Although I am happy to get this up and running, and the focus improved with the different focus divider, I would still like more focus.

I might try the idea in the link I posted above just to see if I can improve it

 

[m_mcgovern]

Let's see pictures of the convergence on the edges, please!

 

[dezbaz]

Let's see pictures of the convergence on the edges, please!

Ok no probs, the wife has the camera interstate till Monday

I am leaving the TV monitor there in place till then. (It's hanging from hooks under a metal work stand)

I will get some opinions after I post some pics.

 

[m_mcgovern]

Yes, for me, this experiment with a raster arcade monitor using a tube compatible with the A63AAX00X, I cannot get the convergence right on the top/bottom edges and it is driving me crazy.

Did you convergence look better than what I've been able to do so far here:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=175655&

 

[dezbaz]

Yes, for me, this experiment with a raster arcade monitor using a tube compatible with the A63AAX00X, I cannot get the convergence right on the top/bottom edges and it is driving me crazy.

Did you convergence look better than what I've been able to do so far here:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=175655&

Yes, my convergence is already better than that (beginners luck), and I have just played around.

I need to read and do the convergence properly to get it even better

Still need better focus if possible

 

[bheineck]

Will this be easier for me if I was able to get an A63AAX00X tube?

Yes, for me, this experiment with a raster arcade monitor using a tube compatible with the A63AAX00X, I cannot get the convergence right on the top/bottom edges and it is driving me crazy.

Did you convergence look better than what I've been able to do so far here:
http://forums.arcade-museum.com/showthread.php?t=175655&